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Classic Who "The Talons of Weng-Chiang" Parts 3&4 Early Access! (Patreon)

Published:
2023-03-10 14:01:00
Imported:
2023-04

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Classic Who "The Talons of Weng-Chiang" Parts 3&4 Reaction

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Comments

James Fish

Thank you for another great and honest reaction to what is clearly a very uncomfortable story for you to provide a reaction to. You do an amazing job, as always. It's a real shame that one aspect of this has to bring down what is otherwise an excellent story. I think it's one many people want to like but find it hard to reconcile the unlikable aspects of it. Much like your reaction to Invasion of the Dinosaurs. The one common element is John Bennett who plays Li H'sen Chang in this and also played the unlikable General in Invasion of the Dinosaurs. The two names on the tip of your tongue in this reaction are Henry Gordon Jago, the Theatre Owner and Casey - the frightened stage hand, both of which I think do a really good job in this. See you next time for the final two parts!

Josef Schiltz

Poor Louise was stuck with glandular fever during the sewer scenes. As if being chewed at by a giant 'rat' wasn't bad enough! These days, of course, there would be a CGI rat, maybe far too well realized for the teatime time slot - around 6 pm if I recall correctly. The better effects on British television, came with the furtherance of the Time Lord's exploits and the series Primeval and their dinosaur effects - after the BBC series Walking With Dinosaurs and Walking With Beasts showed off that convincing effects could be done. This, of course, was after Jurassic Park heaped in audiences and praise. Even the animatronics of the Henson Workshop and The Dark Crystal were still five years in the future I've often imagined what The Web Planet would look like done with those resources.

Amy Chlebus
>>103752128

I also find it unfortunate they did that, however, I am still able to like the story, despite the unlikable depiction. For me, is the same with the reboot. A lot of the show is unlikable for me, but I find bits of it likeable.

James Fish
>>103752128

Yes, I spoke about what I particularly like about this story in the comments of the last reaction. I generally like anything which Robert Holmes wrote. I think one of the unique hallmarks of Stories written by him are that there is always a really intriguing backstory, as with this one and Pyramids of Mars, giving massive potential for a prequel story - not necessarilly featuring the Doctor but of a story or short story in its own right. As with Terrance Dicks, he knew what worked in Classic Who in terms of not getting too over ambitious with the plot.

Josef Schiltz
>>103752128

Writers like Terrance knew how vital clarity is. The 'W' shape of drama where there are peaks of dramatic action to move the story on and the periods of rest. This is the pattern that a previous script editor and writer Dennis Spooner knew achieved vitality and space to breathe. The Classic format allowed for that. Drama has drifted towards hit, hit, hit, hit! Result. The audience gets bored and tired and the attention span falls off. The same discipline exists in imagery. The eyes/mind need areas of rest. Something you don't get with a Jackson Pollock. You get a eye/mind ache. The problems with a 45 minute complete story that I worried about in 2005 were that it would drift towards a time when an episode would be a screen full of noise, with soundbytes of character awkwardly jemmied in to somehow 'convince' that these are 'real' people.

James Fish
>>103752128

That's kind of jogged my memory that you mention this because they spoke about this in something I saw, probably one of the extra features. That being, the difference between how Classic Who was made and how New Who is made. They said about how New Who is much more action heavy where it's just boom - boom - boom, action sequence to action sequence with dialogue crowbarred into scenes where they're running. It seems like the dialogue goes 100 miles per hour in it quite often. With Classic Who, they had much more time for poper dialogue and to discuss how things came about and other aspects of the plot. I didn't think about the W shape of it but I get it, that's really interesting.

Josef Schiltz
>>103752128

It was something mentioned many years ago by Dennis Spooner in an interview in Doctor Who Monthly. The consequence of the lack of breathing space means that the story becomes intellectual frosted glass, thusly impenetrable. This is one of the reasons I turned off. The driving force, the charisma of the centre character, The Doctor, was obfuscated by too many characters competing for screen time, plus a less than engaging performance from Jodie Whittaker. Likeable as she is, away from the role, surrounded by wizardry and a paucity of character building left me thinking "Who is this character except a cartoon?" A character is someone whom you can predict, with a fair amount of certainty, due to their patterns of speech, their characteristics. If you can't get involved because of lack of depth, then the character is lost. Also, that bloody costume could have been designed by a primary school infant. A self-respecting art and design student would have binned it. - and I've been one! The Doctor is not Captain Marvel. She actually looked far better in Capaldi's outfit.

Josef Schiltz
>>103752128

Was that mentioned on DVD extra features by production crew and/or actors? I'm presuming by someone who worked on both! That might narrow the field a bit. I've not bought any Who DVDs for about a decade or so. Not enough money and too much time dealing with a parent with dementia, so that's not something I recall being mentioned on anything I've seen. Brain gets fogged. Old age!

Henry Fuller

My cousin and I would make jokes about that giant rat when this story was on late night tv on WLVI56. Fun times though. Ice cream chips colkies, I think we'd mix up Koolaide or make floats. Fun time. Luckey him to have doctor who on every weekend on late night tv. We had Star Trek and the honeymooners on late night tv where I grew up which I liked too. But I would have liked the whovies too

David Vandervliet

I don’t know if anyone has pointed out that Mr. Sin is played by Deep Roy, the actor who played all the Oompa Loompas in the Willy Wonka movie with Johnny Depp.

James Fish
>>103752128

As I recall I think it was mentioned in one of the Classic Who extras possibly by Terrance Dicks before his passing, but I could be wrong on that, it was some time ago since I watched it. It was quite a lengthy piece featuring lots of people involved from both New and Classic Who where among other things, they spoke about the formats. When I next do a Classic Who binge watch, I'll come back to you and let you know. Sorry to hear of your predicament, since my mums passing the week before Christmas last year, my Dad has been heavily relying on me. What with being in the middle of the grieving process, having to deal with endless red tape, work and making sure I'm ok medically, my heads a little all over the place right now. I find a lot of solace in Jess's Classic Who reactions, somehow helps me cope with it all and allows me to take time out to breathe. Hope you're ok.

Josef Schiltz
>>103752128

Jess and her reactions have done the same for me. It gets tough and we just have to keep going. Sometimes that's all you can do. The ending of Twice Upon A Time just got to me a few minutes ago and I was bawling my eyes out. My own father passed away when I was seven. I kept my mother going until she was 93. Seven years ago yesterday in fact. Her spark just left. I wish you bravery and luck and strength and tenacity. My best wishes to you both and my condolences for your loss.

Josef Schiltz
>>103752128

I've often wondered if Jess has ever seen All Creatures Great and Small, which started around this time. Some of it might be a bit tough for her, given her real love for animals as the show can pack a punch, but I bet she'd love the characters. It would also contextualize our meeting with Peter Davison in his popular pre-Doctor role. Personally, I'd love to see what she thinks of it! Bet she'd love the intro!

James Fish
>>103752128

Thanks for your kind words and the same sentiments to yourself. It's still pretty raw for me. I get good days where I feel fine and bad days where I cry my eyes out, but I hope time will ease things. I used to love All Creatures Great and Small, such an endearing series with an amazing heartfelt theme tune. I miss a lot of the TV we used to have - I think they put a ton more effort into productions back then.

Josef Schiltz
>>103752128

Being a country lad - although Suffolk, rather than Yorkshire - I feel a deep affinity for those folk in All Creatures. I'd love Jess to see at least one episode - or maybe 'The World of James Herriot described by his son' which is only eight minutes in length. The series is matchless and the wonderful scenery and actors. Robert Hardy, Christopher Timothy, Peter Davison and Carol Drinkwater and the marvellously unmatchable Mary Hignett as Mrs Hall. Also, a houseful of dogs! The theme was by Johnny Pearson and was called - if I remember correctly - 'Piano Parchment'. It would be a real change of pace and I bet she would love the characters - based on real people. Good fortune whilst getting through these times to happier ones.

James Fish
>>103752128

Ah ok, am in the heart of Essex myself, but I still love it. Something about that Rural setting which is so peaceful away from bustling city life - rather like Last of the Summer Wine. Yes I saw a piano performance of the theme tune on YouTube. Anywayz, many thanks & you too.