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Quick question - GMTK and syndication (Patreon)

Published:
2016-10-13 06:37:30
Edited:
2016-10-13 08:18:08
Imported:
2021-01

Content

Hey guys and gals. Wanted to run something by you

I've been approached by IGN, and they want to chat to me about two ideas: 1) running a couple existing episodes on the IGN platform and 2) creating some unique content for them

Now I don't think I want to do the latter. I don't need IGN to make stuff - you guys make that possible and together we have complete authorial control. Also, I don't really want videos that don't go on the channel - I love how it's all easily found on one YouTube page. 

Like, did you know that kaptainkristian did an episode on Spider Man? Probably not because it got buried in IGN's videos https://youtu.be/6fO1sY_Dg-M

As for syndicating some existing episodes on IGN - what do you think about that? For me, it sounds okay. One of the many awesome things about Patreon is that I don't really mind if the videos aren't watched on YouTube. 

Like, if people freeboot them on Facebook that's kinda fine because it just reaches more people who might then search me out to subscribe or even support on Patreon. It's not like I'm missing out on ad dollars. 

So it could potentially bring more fans, subscribers, and supporters.

But I'd like to hear your thoughts on this. Wouldn't do it without feeling like I have your support. So any concerns or anything else welcome!

Mark 

Also, keep it under your hat for now. I'm trusting you with this!

Comments

Anonymous

I say go for it man. You keep creating these excellent videos, and we'll keep supporting you. If you have a chance to get it out to more people, spread the word!

Anonymous

As long as you're the one in control and you're making the videos you want to make I'm happy either way. Not a fan of IGN personally but as long as it doesn't interfere with your content I can't see a problem.

Anonymous

Syndication on IGN sounds great! But I don't think IGN exclusive content is a good idea. You should definitely keep your series all in one place.

Anonymous

I'd agree with not allowing other channels or sites exclusivity on any videos, but since you yourself mentioned that other people watching them on Facebook doesn't really do any harm, I don't see any particular harm with allowing IGN to essentially re-host some existing videos for the same reason. It has a chance to reach more people, and if those people are genuinely interested, they'll seek out the Youtube channel anyway. You're gaining some additional views one way or another, but you're not necessarily losing anything.

Anonymous

Go for it if it's good for you, Mark! I understand IGN will earn some money for themselves if they upload your videos on their network, but if you end up with a good pay for it, just do it. Also, I wouldn't mind if you made some content for them, but I understand your feelings towards us and the idea of not giving your patrons those videos. Are they not interested in giving you your own space so your content don't end up getting lost in theirs?

Anonymous

I have no qualms with seeing your content spread beyond YouTube. If it helps you grow and make it easier to keep doing what you're doing, go for it.

Anonymous

Yeah, think I'd say go for it too - if you're happy with syndication and it might draw in new fans defo go for it! But I share the same misgivings with you releasing any exclusive content for IGN.

Anonymous

I have no problem seeing your content syndicated on other platforms, especially ones as large as IGN. Anything that can bring in a wider audience without taking away your control of the final product is a good thing IMHO.

Anonymous

IGN can help reach more viewers. As for "being buried"… Timed exclusive (like Nostalgia Critic)? Teaser on your channel (like Moviebob)?

Anonymous

I think it's a good idea. Since IGN's audience probably is younger in age it could reach new people. If you can pick and choose which episodes, I would say the Mario episode about training the player of the mechanics is a good one to start off the IGN audience.

Anonymous

1) is fine, 2) is bad.

Anonymous

I agree with your conclusions. Syndicate away and reach more viewers, by all means.

Anonymous

Expanding the amount of platforms GMTK is on (with you still getting paid for them of course) is most likely a good thing. Making a "platform exclusive" episode seems like a giant waste of time and resources.

Anonymous

I agree with everyone. Your content on other platforms is wonderful, exclusive content is a bad idea. I like the way you control and author the content by yourself.

Sacha Greif

Couldn't you give IGN say, a one month exclusivity? After which you could put the video on your own YouTube channel.

Anonymous

Do it. Just make sure you'll be allowed to plug your own channel into the videos and they should still pay you for them considering they're using your content.

Anonymous

Get a deal where you syndicate some content, evaluate the impact (more views, patrons etc) and then if it makes financial sense (will let you expand, create content you couldn't before) then make videos for them - and insert a clause that allows you to post that content on here or on the channel. :-)

Anonymous

Go for it! So long as we can see the content in the end and you can get proper credit, super cool to see more stuff

Anonymous

Go for it Mark, having your content on more platforms is nothing but a good thing. Makes it more accessible to a larger audience

Anonymous

If you retain full creative control and ownership, I don't see any downside.

Anonymous

I concur with all of the above, further syndication can only be good for you! (though look forward to the youtube commenters haha!)

Anonymous

It never hurts to have more visibility, this will make people curious about your YouTube channel and Patreon. 👍🏻

Anonymous

I'd agree with what most people have said, and what you're leaning towards yourself, i.e. syndicated content, but your primary platform is your own YouTube channel. It would be absolutely fair for you to make money by giving IGN (or anyone else) exclusivity, although that's probably also the point where I'd eventually think, "Looks like he doesn't need Patreon any more, he's getting a salary elsewhere."

Anonymous

Totally agree with you. More exposure is great, but don't do the exclusive content, keep control over what you do and how you do it ;-)

Anonymous

I'm OK with number 1, but number 2 doesn't sound that good.

Liam Harvey

Yup, I'm in agreement with you and a lot of folk here—syndication sounds like a win-win. I'd love more exposure for GMT and it's really smart material for a wider audience. You're educating at the end of the day, broadening the conversation beyond the usual metrics and critical vocabulary. The fact that they've reached out to YOU (well done by the way!) speaks volumes. I'd be fascinated by the ripple effects of this; either it positively changes your viewership or the IGN audience doesn't quite take to it (in an ideal world, they, of course, WOULD). Either way, you gain valuable data.

Anonymous

Number 1 sounds great for getting new followers. Number 2 can work, but it would have to be a completely new series made for IGN and separate from GMTK. If they're paying nicely for it, and you don't mind the increased work load, it could be a good way to make something new and get that sweet sweet cash.

Anonymous

Go for it mate! I'd probably go for #1, but #2 could work too!

Anonymous

#1 sounds like a net win for everyone. More viewers is never bad, right? Also, heads up that the titles of the Patron-only posts are publicly visible on your page. If you're trying to keep things on the down low, you might want to edit the title to remove IGN's name.

GameMakersToolkit

Thanks guys. Really good feedback! Looks like syndication makes sense, exclusive episodes less so. I'll see where the negotiations go and let you know what's going to happen. And i'll change the post title - forgot about that :P

Anonymous

I'm up for syndication as well but I think you should get more out of it than just exposure. I don't know what IGN usually offers the content creators for their videos but it seems wrong to me they just get the videos for free.

Anonymous

I agree with you and everyone else. Now I'm just off to search for kaptainkristian's Spider-man video.

Anonymous

I agree Mark – 1 sounds good. It's not a lot of extra work for a lot more exposure. Heck if they pay you as well that's a bonus, right? As a Patreon that wouldn't bother me as you put it back into GMT!

Anonymous

I stopped taking IGN's reviews seriously over a decade ago and view the company pretty negatively.. The most recent thing they've done that's upset me is the anti-Sonic ranting on one of their podcasts.. Do whatever is best for you though! o.o;

Anonymous

I don't think you should pass up a profitable business or networking opportunity, but I'm not likely to search for your videos on IGN. I prefer following a few channels with more focused content. If you can get them to allow you to also share the video on your channel, I say go for both. If they won't I'd say make a very similar video for your own channel, or just stick with syndication.

Anonymous

Original GMTK content seems like a bit much, but syndication could work. I won't say "I'm all for syndication" because I don't know what kind of agreement they're offering. I would be on board with something with proper licensing that offers you something other than 'exposure on their platform', something that doesn't infringe on your ultimate control over your IP, and (most importantly IMHO) something that doesn't hack the content out of your videos so they can open everything with a big IGN logo and silently drop any mention of your YT or Patreon in the video itself. I mean, you have >100k subs on YT. If IGN is contacting you about this, it's because they stand to profit from the exceptional content you're putting out. Just don't let them treat it like *they're* doing *you* a favor.

Anonymous

I think syndication is fine. Original content for them would be ok for short term, but like you said, there's a lot of problems with visibility and long term preservation too.

Anonymous

I agree with you, Mark. I think the most important thing is that you feel comfortable with your videos and if you don't fancy the idea of making specific videos for IGN, is best to "just" go with 1)

Anonymous

As many people mentioned #1 would be fine since it improves exposure to a new audience. I particularly agree with "Nemo": GMTK is yours and should remain that way. Maybe you could work out some kind of partnership where you put the IGN logo on the intro and description on GMTK videos that go up on your chanmel, something less invasive (although I don't really know if this would actually benefit them).

PrimeSonic

As long as you're the one with full and absolute creative control, then that's fine. You started this Patreon to avoid having sponsors getting their hands too far into your content. So with that said, existing videos being shared with them is probably fine. But I would throw caution to the wind about producing anything for them.

Anonymous

You sure know how to make us feel special, Mark ^^ But I think it all just boils down to if it would benefit you or not. And I think you are right that having them embed some of your videos on their side will benefit you. But I would be sad to see you making exclusive videos - I think in the end that will IGN more than you.

Anonymous

Hi! I would like to watch some orginal content from a partnership between you and IGN. Sure they have some resources that you can't get (now) with our support. And that project can help you grow the Patreon Group, and I think that will be awesome. It means more money to make more content. Sure, you need to be confortable. But won't you like to make, let's say, a 5 episode series with them? Plus, you could post this special series' making of on your channel.

Vinícius Pimentel Couto

As everyone is saying, number 1 is totally fine. As for number 2, if you could post the videos on the channel a little later or something like that, I don't think I would mind. As you said, I don't think it would benefit you if your videos were all chaotically spread around the internet.

Maene Erinys

I say YES for #1 and NOPE for #2. Reaching more people is awesome, but splitting your material between different channels and websites is not a good idea. Besides, you risk losing creative control.

Ossian Olausson

I don't really mind i think you should do what you feel like

Maene Erinys
>>2766129

"Vinícius"? Será que achei outro desenvolvedor Brasileiro (ou Português) no GMTK? Olá de Curitiba BTW!

Casey Jones

I had seen kaptainkristian's video on IGN and initially thought they'd poached one of his videos illegally, until I learned he'd been contracted for that one episode. It's a bit of a weird approach for IGN to offer to host videos for people, but as long as they don't turn into a lumbering MCN monstrosity like Machinima, I don't see any harm in posting a video on their channel. It's some extra cash in your pocket, and it'll give you some new eyes on your videos and maybe bring in some new viewers to your channel. It sucks that you wouldn't be able to post the video on your own channel afterward, though. Option 2, doing some unique content for IGN, sounds like it could be a good or bad choice. Speaking as a freelancer, it'd be a great opportunity for a good gig. But as you said, if you're able to support yourself off of what you're making on Patreon, why bother? It's your call, but the biggest worry I'd have is that juggling that contract with your GMT commitments may end up spreading you a bit thin and only serve to stress/burn you out. Take it on if you really need it, but otherwise, I'm happy with what I'm getting from you on GMT.

GameMakersToolkit
>>2766453

sorry, i think i've confused you a bit. the kaptainkristian video would be an example of option 2 - creating unique content. so he made that for IGN and it's not on his youtube channel. option 1 would be taking videos that already exist on my channel and just hosting them on IGN's site.

Doctor Professor

Sorry if this was already stated - there are a lot of comments now and I skimmed but couldn't read them all closely. :) I agree with what seems to be the prevailing opinion, that letting IGN host some of your videos seems fine but exclusive content is probably not a great idea given your goals. But that's a naive opinion as I've never worked with IGN. My recommendation, if possible, would be to find someone who's done both these things and ask them how they went, and in particular if there was anything that surprised them or made them wish they had decided differently. It may be that IGN has some sneaky things they do when they host your videos, or it may be that they're a truly excellent partner in creating new content. If you can find out whether one of these things is true before making up your mind, that would help steer you well.

Anonymous

Running your existing content on IGN sounds awesome, but making content specifically for them would only limit viewership. I'd say pass on #2.

Anonymous

Yeah, I agree with your thoughts on all this. #1 sounds like a great opportunity, and #2 sounds iffy. No matter what you do though, I'm behind you 100% :)

Anonymous

#1 = 👌💃

Anonymous

Do it! Seems like a solid way to reach a larger audience.

Anonymous

Throwing my two cents in: Something like Boss Keys would make sense for IGN — a side project that could lead people to your Patreon-supported YouTube channel. (Syndication is a bit hard to wrap my head around; for instance, Polygon has embedded your YouTube videos in the past. What's the difference here?) I'd say that the main thing about us Patreons is we want you to be successful — that's why we support you. Whatever your professional goals are, chase them!

Anonymous

I'd say go for it. I don't support you to thumb my nose at major outlets; I do it because you create awesome content.

Aimée

Go for it. Your reasoning is sound to me!

Anonymous

More fans is good! Syndicating sounds fine.

Andrey Kurenkov

Syndication sounds logical, why not?! #2 would not be cool, unless perhaps it'd make sense if you are given the option to collaborate with IGN people - could yield more ambitious results with more resources.

Anonymous

Do what brings you the most success. Some people have concerns about #2. Well, is it a one time thing? That might not be a bad thing. Is it a different audience? Maybe you can do something that would be more geared to that and bring more attention to your work. Just make sure YOU are happy with the decision you make and not something you feel pressured in doing (or not doing) because of "reasons".

Anonymous

If you feel it's a good idea, go for it! Anything that helps you get more money out of the videos without sacrificing control must be a good thing, in my book :).

Anonymous

Definitely syndicate those videos. If you have the time and the resources, make some videos for IGN and if you don't like their editorial process, then leave! That's what that F.U. Patreon money is for.

Anonymous

Do it. If possible make sure you can post the videos later yourself on your own channel. And even if not, this exercise will make you better and more experienced regardless. - T.

Anonymous

All for sharing your videos. Less thrilled with IGN exclusive content, for the reasons you said. Timed exclusive wouldn't bother me much.

OSW Review

Hey Mark, here's my advice as a guy who also makes his living on Patreon: If you can get extra clams for work you've already done, definitely do it! Everyone here wants to see you succeed and grow, and syndicating to IGN will get more eyeballs on you. A small caveat but before agreeing to anything, you'll need to set out what IGN need to do (eg link to your YouTube in the description, end title cards etc) so there's no miscommunication/hurt feelings. They churn out content like nobody's business, so it's a small window of exposure. Re: Unique content, I'd also say go for it. We still get to see it, even if it's not on the regular channel. Being commissioned by IGN is a cool feather in the cap. I'd recommend adding that you can upload the video after X amount of time (even if it's 6 months, just for completion of your channel) In the end your fans are supporting you to make content you're happy with, so if you're happy, go for it!

Anonymous

Absolutely - I love what you're doing, and want to see you be able to use/syndicate the content however you see fit!

Anonymous

I don't see any issue if IGN wants to put your videos on their platform. It doesn't effect your work in anyway as far as I can tell, and if the end results is you get more supporters, then all the better. As for unique content on IGN - I'm not enthusiastic about it, since I agree with you that it's great to have these videos all in one place. I won't withdraw support if you want to do that, and honestly you should do what you think is best. Cheers

Rich Stoehr

I love the idea of your work getting more exposure, Mark - it certainly deserves it! I honestly hope game designers are watching/listening. IGN could help you get more attention, and more patrons! Not a bad thing... I don't know what IGN's contract would look like, but I guess the original content would depend on what they wanted you to do. Like, would working with them on something original mean you might get access that you wouldn't otherwise have? Your videos are already insightful - I've sometimes wondered how much more you might be able to say if you spoke with the actual creators, designers, artists, etc. Maybe a chance to try something new? But, not if it feels like you're compromising what you want. You're already a success!

Anonymous

go for #1 only time exclusive if you end up doing #2

Anonymous

#1 is probably fine, but I'd agree with most people that #2 is probably not the best idea, especially if you are already making money. I'm personally not a fan of IGN, but I certainly wouldn't begrudge you for wanting to get more exposure for something you enjoy doing.