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Premium 19 - Immanuel Velikovsky: Heresy, Freud, Catastrophism, Spies, Psychological Operations, and the Occult (Patreon)

Published:
2022-03-14 21:33:34
Imported:
2022-03

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Today I go through the life and times of Immanuel Velikovsky, one of the most interesting figures in recent times. I discuss the importance of Freud to Velikovsky's works, and the main themes of Worlds in Collision. I discuss Einstein's relationship to Velikovsky, and Velikovsky's network of followers. While this is probably not the final word on Velikovsky, I think I come to a pretty grounded explanation of how and why the Velikovsky affair got so out of hand, and why Catastrophists and New Chronologists all seem to be spooks and occultists.


Songs:

Saturn by Sufjan Stevens

Venus by Frankie Avalon

For What It's Worth by Buffalo Springfield

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laihall

Vine deloria NOOOOO

Anonymous

I am pumped beyond measure

laihall

Hahaha absolutely. Theres been positive development imo in that scholars are now fighting to have their nations ontologies and epistemologies recognized as equal on their own merits - without using hairbrained ops like velikovsky to provide a citation. Getting to say “my elder told me” in a bibliography fuckin rules

Keith Allen Dennis

Long time listener first time subscriber and ho-lee sheeit there’s some good stuff here. Velikovsky! Yes, heard of him, read at least part of Worlds in Collision like 25 years ago. In my youthful surfing of the fringes his name would come up alongside others like Zecheriah Stichin. Was too young to grasp the notion of Velikovskys work as a species of “occulted occultism” whereby pseudo-scientific speculations are a delivery device for occult doctrine but hot damn that dog will hunt. Without saying which leads to which, it is enough to say such writings might often appear in a gumbo in which all sorts of goodies are stewed in: Godfrey Higgins, Theosophy, Hamlet’s Mill, Von Daniken, Franz Bardon, neo-Sabianism, any sort of 18-19th century Astro-theology speculation really. Like any of these authors and their books could easily appear on the same shelf as the others. The theme about “refocusing attention” through disruptive “Larouchian” means and the particular areas to which such attentions could be refocused is very insightful. Just, thanks for that in general man. I’d like to take that and build on it in light of the above and my own experience. That bookshelf referred to above was mine once upon a time. Would throw in Hancock, Bauval, John Anthony West, and all those Egyptian stargate conspiracy weirdos. One could even throw Ivan Sertima, Cyrus Gordon, Barry Fell and other fringe “diffusionist” speculators about pre-Columbian colonization from old world to new, the Atlantean fuckery of Ignatius Donnelly, and on and on. The above is just a slice or so of a biggo list of “speculative” science, archaeology, history, myth, religion, etc. across a number of disciplines or whatever, but what they all have in common is an adversarial relationship to the “science” from which they demand a dubious legitimacy. Blavatsky says everything we know about religious history is wrong; Velikovsky says everything we know about planetary physics is wrong; the Hancock/Bauval/Hawass Stargate Industrial Complex says everything we know about Egypt is wrong; the Tao of Poo guy says everything we know about Poo is wrong, and on and on. One notion I’ve been mildly obsessed with the last year is that of the “Cultic Milieu,” a term which comes from someone named Colin Campbell. Basically it describes the fringe of “rejected knowledge” and its adherents. Without calling it by that name, James Webb in his excellent books The Occult Underground and the Occult Establishment describes the same phenomenon. Thing about the cultic milieu is it invites “promiscuity” on the part of its adherents; come for the crystal hugging, stay for the flat earth stuff, we got breakout sessions over here for the “pyramidiots,” another over here for the “quantum” weirdos, and hey over here we got your Raelians hey whats with the swastika guys, etc. If one is already on the fringe, one is already among fellow fringe surfers busy hawking their own pet issues (“the Sphinx couldn’t possibly be that young!” yeah but who cares lol). Your comments about “refocusing attention” really made an impression because of what it suggests, not just about Velikovsky but the whole pot o’ gumbo. It really seems like in the 60s and esp in the 70s there was this blossoming of all sorts of new flora and fauna on the lunatic fringe. Like not just holding onto older strata like theosophy or Atlantean speculations but a lot of new stuff, some of which was built upon those earlier foundations but others wholly novel (like jet-age UFO culture, mothman, Downard, etc). I am convinced there was a deliberate propagation of this cottage industry of rejected knowledge—and that longitudinal psywar meme-seeding was what it was all about. If you’ve got a malignant strain, like a q-anon cult tadpole for instance, you can simply throw it into the gumbo and just by being in the stew it’s gonna attract and recruit for itself because the inherent promiscuity of the cultic milieu will do the work for you. The old rense dot com website was the perfect example: you got cryptozoology here, fringe Egyptology there, all kinds of new age stuff laying around all over, and embedded in it all is old JBS guys ranting about the federal reserve, larouche was a regular guest and hey here’s an essay on the “enduring mystique of hitler” hey again with the swastikas wtf guys, etc. You could even say that old, long CNN interview with Bill Cooper has the same dynamic all in one long interview: he didn’t lead off with repeating the old JBS saw “it’s a republic not a democracy, let’s keep it that way,” that’s in there but it’s buried deep. No he starts off talking about seeing UFOs come up out of the ocean while in the navy—and being told by his superiors to forget all about it. Relegating what he’d supposedly seen with his own eyes into the realm of “rejected knowledge” by the deep state which naturally does the rejecting, and which in doing so reveals itself as “the adversary.” Tldr: you gave some compelling reasons why MacMillan would publish Velikovsky over the exasperation of actual scientists back in the day. But what if part of that reasoning was to plant seeds that would grow and challenge consensus reality itself? I mean scientific, religious, government, etc etc. if you wanted to overthrow all that you’d need believers who maybe came for a radical reimagining of planetary science and stayed for the “great awakening?” I mean… https://gnosticwarrior.com/secrets-and-shickshiny-knights.html

Keith Allen Dennis
>>80101076

Oh yeah one more thing. Guess who gave some kinda speech at a Velikovsky conference in 1980? Why, air and political warfare strategist, "scientific racist" and WACL stalwart Stefan Possony. https://oac.cdlib.org/findaid/ark:/13030/tf4489n6nn/entire_text/

ProgrammedToChill
>>80101076

that's a great shortlist of 'speculative' or alternative authors and their 'rejected knowledge'. and yeah, this whole ecosystem really is like a gumbo or like, some kind of stew or fertilizer for whatever you want to pull out, like QAnon, exactly. challenging consensus reality seems to be the goal, and idk maybe I sound crazy for suggesting that we probably shouldn't abandon consensus reality just yet? and brother, don't get me started on the shickshinny knights, though if I did, I'd punt right back over to you and the Farm for the most part, lol

Steve Ray
>>80017776

The goal of all that is to destroy the academy and demoralize the West, in hopes of making people less invested in reproducing current structures of oppression and inequities in material conditions.