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Star Wars Episode 3 - Revenge of the Sith (Part 2)

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Ryan

As flawed as the prequels often are, this movie's double climax is to me one of the greatest moments of the entire franchise. Yoda and Palpatine literally tearing apart the foundation of the Republic and its symbol of democracy, while Obi Wan and Anakin's falling out reaches its inevitable tragic climax (with most of the fight actually being Ewan and Hayden themselves at full speed, after an ungodly amount of practicing the choreography together). And all scored with Battle of the Heroes, one of the greatest gifts John Williams gave to the series.

Anonymous

Little fun fact: There is a novel version of Episode 3 and in the novel it says that Obi-Wan's mount sensed Order 66 and the clones' betrayal, so it positioned itself to take the shot. Soooo, it probably didn´t survive - sorry :( Honestly, Episode 3 hits soooo much harder after watching The Clone Wars! I can´t wait for the last two weeks of Clone Wars - I´m sad it´s over soon :(

Anonymous

Again, there is a LOT to say, and I'll have to space the comments out. I’ll try to restrain myself and try not to be too garrulous, but I am unable to make any promises. I do apologize if any of it is too much. One thing for sure, I'm going to be gushing about John Williams as like I said, his score for this is my favorite film score, and in the second half of the film, John really goes above and beyond with composing what feels like a requiem; a grand and glorious mass. Attempting to do this systematically, I'll start by discussing my favorite character, the Emperor. Or, should I call him Darth Sidious? It's frightening his scenes where he duels Mace Windu, specifically how he still wears the mask of Palpatine, and yet, he lets the Sidious persona be on full display. And then once the mask of Palpatine is destroyed how he throws any and all restraint out the window, along with Mace, and proceeds to gleefully and giddily devour every square inch of the scenery with such theatricality and gusto that is beautiful to behold. You can tell that Ian McDiarmid had the time of his life in this movie. A powerful scene where the Emperor has his magnificent new era speech of forming the first Galactic Empire, juxtaposing the scene of Anakin massacring the Separatists, underscored by the first half of John’s theme Anakin’s Dark Deeds. A massively underrated theme by the way, though thankfully it’s been gaining popularity in recent years. As you observe, credit must be given to the Emperor for how superbly and masterfully he planned all of this. And how the Senate just goes along with it. In fairness, the majority of them don’t have much choice as they allowed the Emperor to gain the power that he did. Thus, if they attempt to protest, their careers and credibility will be destroyed. It's like killing Caesar. Everyone’s guilty. Yes, that is a powerful line Padmé has in that scene. Then there’s the insane fight between the Emperor and Yoda, brilliantly underscored by John reprising both Clash of the Lightsabers and Duel of the Fates. Credit to Frank Oz for conveying Yoda’s righteous fury in his fight with the Emperor, and much credit for Ian bringing to life the Emperor’s Joie de vivre as he symbolically and literally destroys the Republic to fight Yoda. Now onto Order 66, and to again demonstrate my lack of shame, both this week and last week I had my coffee in my Order 66 coffee mug when sitting down to watch these reactions. Yes, I am fully aware that I am a wicked, wicked man. What do you want from me? Words fail to convey how emotional and devastating it was to see Order 66 in the theater for the first time, and that emotional devastation has grown significantly in these seventeen years hence. Yeah, as you say, there is greater emotional investment once you’ve seen The Clone Wars, but even back then, it was heart wrenching, particularly the first-time hearing John’s tragically beautiful theme Anakin’s Betrayal that underscores the sequence. I KNEW, Jess, that the scene with Plo Koon was going to be a scene that would devastate you. Rewatching this to prepare for your reactions, you were on my mind. When you yelled out “NOOOOOO!!!!” during Plo’s final scene, that got me in the heart bad enough that I had to pause. I was not ready for how much that hurt. Regarding the delightful creature, yes, we are choosing to believe that she made it; that Obi-Wan used the Force to save her. By the way, concerning the fact that you didn’t recognize Chewbacca until his name was said, don't worry because surprisingly, a lot of people don’t catch that Chewie is in this until his name is said. It was emotional that Peter Mayhew returned to play Chewie again.

Anonymous

Now onto the main event of Anakin becoming the beloved Darth Vader. I am forever going to defend Hayden Christensen as I believe he was fantastic in this. Sure, the dialogue may not be the best at times, still it is my belief that Hayden delivers a great performance. You summed it up perfectly, Jess, in that Anakin just goes full out let me be evil mode in his attempt to save Padmé. There is of course the spiritual element of once the Dark Side takes over, it goes to town at an alarming rate, like poison in the blood stream. Like Yoda once said, “Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny.” Yet as you succinctly observe, Anakin burns the bridges with the Jedi with his actions against Mace, thus he has no other option but to join the Emperor and lean into the Dark Side as heavily as he does. Or at the very least he believes that he has no other choice. I remember how people complained how abrupt it seemed, and those complaints made such an impression that when people similarly complained about Daenerys in the last season of Game of Thrones, I was laughing some, and saying, “I heard all this fourteen years ago when Revenge of the Sith came out.” You had the exact same reaction that I did during the youngling scene. That scene was a shock and a half. My thought process was, “Ok, we knew this movie was going to be dark. I didn’t think they’d go THAT dark! Holy Moley!” Concerning the scene of the younglings, the fandom never lets Anakin hear the end of it, nor do we let him live it down. Evidence of this is that we’ve made shitload upon shitload of jokes and memes about it over the last seventeen years now. We’re pretty sick fucks about it to be perfectly honest. On the other hand, the scene of Anakin wiping out the Separatists is such a cathartic moment, especially how he saves Nute Gunray to the last. That was immensely satisfying to see in the theater. One's heart does break for Obi-Wan and Padmé both when they learn the truth. Ewan McGregor sells the pain that Obi-Wan feels in that, especially when he tells Padmé. And the scene is aided by the second half of the theme Anakin’s Dark Deeds. When I first saw this, going into it, I was most afraid about what would happen to Padmé. Seventeen years later, and the scenes where she confronts Anakin, and subsequently where he force-chokes her still cut deep into my heart and soul. Natalie Portman never fails to make me cry in those scenes. You apologize for your reactions to the climactic lightsaber duel between Anakin and Obi-Wan. No apologies are necessary, Jess, as you had the perfect emotional reaction to that. I admit I'm blown away by the spectacle, especially for the impressive work of both Ewan and Hayden in the fight choreography. But when you boil it down, it is one of the most tragic sequences in the saga seeing the two brothers locked in the duel to the death. And all of it is made all the more powerful by John composing my favorite theme of the prequel trilogy, as well as one of my top five favorite themes of John’s, and that is the operatic and mournful theme, Battle of the Heroes. Again, credit to both Ewan and Hayden in the final scene of the duel where Obi-Wan decisively utilizes the high ground to cripple Anakin. The pure anguish in Obi-Wan's voice in that scene is powerful, as is the hatred and ultimately pain in Anakin’s voice. All of this is underscored by John’s strings piece aptly named The Immolation Scene, which listening to it by itself causes the tears to flow.

Anonymous

Then there’s the final scenes of Padmé and the birth of both Luke and Leia juxtaposed with Anakin’s final transformation into Vader. Again, John delivers most superb music during that scene. You're not alone in having an issue with the manner in which Padmé dies. This has been a common criticism over the years, though it has lessened some following the death of Carrie Fisher and the following day how the death of her mother, Debbie Reynolds rather eerily paralleled the events of the film, thus the fans have eased up on criticizing that specific aspect of the film. I will say that though that aspect never bothered me all that much, I agree with you in that it’s not an invalid critique. If it helps most subsequent material explore the idea that Anakin caused physical damage to Padmé which went undetected by the medical droids, and that’s what killed her. In any case, Padmé’s death will forever make me cry, and that shot of the necklace that Anakin made for her really lets the tears flow. The moment when the mask of Vader is lowered onto Ankain, and he draws his first breaths is no exaggeration, the quietest moment I have ever experienced in a theater. Nobody made a sound. It was profound. And to then hear James Earl Jones once again as Darth Vader, particularly when he says Padmé’s name stirred emotions. The ending sequences were very bittersweet. I love the shot of the Emperor and Vader overseeing the construction of the Death Star. With it, I also had a moment of excitement when I saw who was with them, and said, “Wait, is that Tarkin?” It’s emotional hearing Leia’s Theme when Bail Organa brings Leia to Alderaan and he and Breha hold her. I remember in the theater my brother getting particularly emotional hearing Leia’s Theme being played. And to end on the scene of Obi-Wan bringing Luke to Tatooine and closing on the last shot of Joel Edgerton and Bonnie Piesse as Owen and Beru, well, as I say it was most emotional. To briefly talk about C-3PO, yes tis a shame he’s not in it much, even then, Anthony Daniels is great in the scenes he has as 3PO. A great full circle Easter egg is that 3PO has the first line of the original Star Wars film, and in this film, what was to be the last, 3PO has the final line. I tell you Jess, this truly was one of your best reactions. All of this has taken me back to the summer of 2005 when I saw Revenge of the Sith three times over that summer, when I listened to the soundtrack on repeat, and when I read the most phenomenal novelization by Matt Stover. Seriously, anyone who hasn’t read it, do yourself a favor and buy it and read it as it is perfection. Another thing that was perfection, Jess, were these videos. They are like early Christmas presents, and some of the greatest Christmas presents that I have ever received. I am crying, I loved these videos so much. You have my most sincere gratitude, Jess. Truly and sincerely, thank you so very much.

Ryan

The novelization has a truly nightmarish depiction of Anakin being put in the suit which would fit perfectly in the darkest Black Mirror episode. And oddly enough fits perfectly with Hayden's later role in the film Awake, as a guy stuck awake and paralyzed during surgery.

Ryan

Palpatine being so furious while shooting lightning at Luke has a lot more context when you know it's literally the first time in DECADES that someone has refused to follow his script.

Anonymous

Yeah, that moment is so great. Just how the Emperor has the look of genuine incomprehension which then morphs into expressions of pure, unadulterated hatred and rage over from his perception, Luke having the unmitigated temerity and gall to refuse to dance on the strings that are held by the Emperor.

Ryan

And as much as Rise of Skywalker has a lazy script that's probably not worth the effort, my headcanon is that after being brought back, Palpatine is so obsessed with balancing that failure out of his record that he overplays his hand while trying the exact same scheme and blows his plan to Rey that he wants her to kill him. And then refuses to stop throwing lightning even as it becomes clear she's just reflecting it back at him because it's just all he can think to do, like someone who always spams the same move in a fighting game.

Anonymous

Speaking as someone who altogether has no problem with The Rise of Skywalker, though, admittedly, yes, it does have its flaws, I hold a similar view in that his patience snapped giving way for his arrogance, overconfidence, and obsession to demolish much of his restraint and self-discipline.

Anonymous

I'm similar to you Thomas. I love Star Wars and have no real issues with the sequels, outside of some lazily written characters. Switch the brain off, and they are a lot of fun in the main, far more than Attack Of The Clones thats for sure! :P

Anonymous

Wow Thomas, these replies must have took you hours to type up! I thought I was bad on another reactors channel with my dissertations of Rebels every episode! :P Sith is the culmination of a lot of things though, so it does require a lot said about it.

Anonymous

Will need to get these two reactions fused together into my own edit, which I shall get around to tomorrow after the World Cup. Should be fun to see how Jess reacts to the film, and little Ani going loopy! :P

Anonymous

Haha. Yeah, it is like the line in V for Vendetta, “Verily, this vichyssoise of verbiage veers most verbose.” It did take a little while to write it all. As you say, there is much to say about Revenge of the Sith. My passion for it does cause me to become quite the Chatty Cathy. It seems I can't help myself.

Anonymous

Oh yeah I'm exactly the same, I have all my notes typed up ahead of time before the reactors put them up sometimes! Part of the reason why we are here though, to see how Jess and others will react to the shows and films we love; and to chat with others about it. All good fun! :D I used to consider myself a bit of a film buff, but I've never seen V For Vendetta strangely. It does seem to be well-liked though. Should look it out one day.

Anonymous

Yeah, I do the same in that I brainstorm in advance, and on occasion type up preliminary notes of what I would like to say. Usually as a way to trim the fat, though, as evidenced by my comments here, I'm not always successful in that. It's great mental exercise at times if nothing else. V for Vendetta is worth checking out. I know it’s not the most faithful adaptation of the graphic novel, nor is it everyone’s cup of tea, still worth watching once at the very least.

Anonymous

First time I've seen this in about a decade, and its interesting watching it knowing all the back story from Clone Wars now with the characters. Obviously this was made before the animation started, but TCW did a great job fleshing out the prequels to expand on this time, and everything that is going on with the politics, the Jedi and the Sith manipulations. One or two pieces of dialogue aside, which doesn't quite work in comparison with TCW now - but its very minor stuff - it all matches up very well. As a mere mortal and not one of these demi-gods, we can empathise with Anakin about not wanting to lose someone he loves dearly, especially when he thinks he has the power within him, to stop that from happening. What Yoda says to him about training to 'let go of all you fear to lose', may come off as cold to us, but it is great advice for a Jedi because of this very issue becoming a major problem for a seriously powerful force user like Anakin. For me, Anakin isn't Jedi Knight material (ironically his own Padawan was far more a Jedi Knight than him), let alone Jedi Master rank. In the past, Padawans would only partake in the Trials For Knighthood, once they had mastered themselves. However due to the amount of Jedi being killed off, Padawans are getting promoted to Knights quicker to make up the numbers, and some aren't ready, like Kit Fisto's ex-padawan Nadhar who Grievous kills, Barriss Offee, and Anakin Skywalker. But due to his preternatural abilities on the battlefield, he was made a General right at the start of the war. Being a Jedi isn't about how great a warrior one is, how strong in the force they are, or how brilliant a swordsman they are; its about serving the people of the Republic and the will of the force selflessly. Anakin has been living a lie these past three years and he should have made a choice, a hard choice that his master made with Satine, and his padawan Ahsoka made, when she left the order. By wanting his cake and trying to eat it, he has been put between a rock and a hard place; but had he listened to his Jedi teachings, none of this would have been an issue. As it is, by not choosing, he is doomed to fall and that will end up tearing the galaxy apart, as he helps the Devil achieve his goals. I understand what you are saying Sesska about the Council and the likes of Mace Windu on it. They aren't perfect, and the Jedi are at their worst here. We've seen that with how they treated Ahsoka during her trial and how they are a bit aloof with Anakin, though its more justified because they see he isn't ready yet and they see the ego he hasn't yet dropped get the better of him, so don't give him what he wants. The Jedi Order doesn't help themselves, nor does Anakin, who ends up making bad decision after bad decision. You make a good point about Obi-Wan and he is a perfect example of someone who is an emotional Jedi, but doesn't let his emotions define him. Anakin never learnt to control that and hence Kenobi in the end becomes 'more powerful than you could possibly imagine' and one of the greatest Jedi in history; while Anakin becomes self-pitying angry Sith cyborg, Darth Vader. For us, if we make mistakes or go down a dark path, we can sometimes find a way out, find redemption or accept our errors of judgement and in some circumstances, can come back to try to become better people. This doesn't always happen, but there is a chance it can. For a force-user though, the darkside is a very real condition, one in which you lose yourself entirely and is nearly impossible to come back from. The reason the Jedi try to control themselves and their power, is because they know there is this cliff waiting for them to plummet from, if they lose their way. Once Anakin chose to go down that path, his empathy and compassionate side, were lost, and as Yoda put it, was consumed by Darth Vader. Hence the killing of kids, while the most horrific thing anyone could do, was not an issue for Vader. THAT is why he should have listened to his teachings. Lucas called Star Wars the tragedy of Darth Vader, and Anakin was the warning of someone who made all the wrong choices. God yeah seeing Plo get shot down, is horrifying knowing what a great guy he was. One of the best. Got to love the balls on Palpatine though, announcing the declaration of himself Emperor and the beginning of the Empire, whilst wearing actual Sith robes! And then later throwing the whole Senate at Yoda. What a legend! :D As an aside, both Ewan McGregor and Natalie Portman look like knockouts in this film. Portman especially, those eyebrows would bring a Sith to their knees! Can't wait to see you react to Kenobi once you are done with the final arc of Clone Wars; its a flawed series, but the notes it needs to hit, man it delivers. I never had much time for Anakin, but Vader is iconic.

Anonymous

Yeah, I mean, the film was always phenomenal. Has been since it first came out in 2005. Everything in The Clone Wars does a marvelous job of expanding on it, fleshing it out, and altogether making it even better than it already was. Like you say we can certainly empathize with Anakin. Something that never really gets commented on is how Yoda offering the advice of “Train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose” is easier for him to say as he’s 877 years old at that point. He's doubtlessly seen many fellow Jedi and/or other people in his lifetime born and died, thus setting aside his being a Jedi, he’s probably desensitized from death. Even so, it is as you say, something a Jedi would have to take to heart, for the greater good, otherwise a Jedi runs the risk of exactly what happens to Anakin. I find I’m somewhat protective of Anakin some, though certainly, I don’t defend his actions; I'm not making any excuses, nor am I justifying any of that. I've often speculated that in addition to the fact that yes, as you say, his ego is quite elephantine to begin with, he also has some form of mental condition or ailment, I've heard others speculate that he has borderline personality disorder. My thought is that if so, it hinders his emotional maturity in some ways, more specifically his ability to broaden his horizons, perspective-wise, and see things from others’ point of view. There’s a line Claude Rains had in The Wolf Man that makes me think of Anakin some. “To some people, life is very simple. They decide that this is good, that is bad. This is wrong, that's right. There's no right in wrong, no good in bad. No shadings and greys, all blacks and whites. Now others of us find that good, bad, right, wrong, are many-sided, complex things. We try to see every side but the more we see, the less sure we are.” And even if this wasn’t the case, there’s still the matter of the Emperor essentially pouring poisoned honeys into Anakin’s ear for the better part of thirteen years, thus fueling and cultivating Anakin’s ego. Plo Koon’s death was one that hurt even way back when, as like Filoni, I was taken with him. I had also read about him in the visual dictionaries and other supplemental material, so there was an investment and sadness when he was shot down and killed. But yes, definitely after you see The Clone Wars, his death is one of the most heartbreaking scenes of the film. Yeah, I love the sheer audacity of the Emperor with his going full regalia with the crimson robes of the Sith, and then when he threw the Seante at Yoda. The whole Seante; it’s awesome! Of course, Ian is beyond magnificent in this whole film. All of his scenes, I want to quote Brendan Gleeson’s character from Gangs of New York by saying, “Now that was bloody Shakespearean! You know who Shakespeare was? He's the fella who wrote the King James Bible!” Padmé doth have most impressive eyebrows in this. Concerning the Obi-Wan show, honestly, I loved it. I didn’t have any real problems with it. The few quibbles that were had got overshadowed by everything in it that I loved. Yeah, in terms of Star Wars characters, Darth Vader is ranked much higher than Anakin on my list. He's second only to the Emperor on my list of favorite Star Wars characters, and he’s third behind the Emperor and Hannibal Lecter in terms of favorite characters of anything.

Anonymous

Thats a fair point about Yoda stating its easier for him to say that to Anakin about letting go due to his advanced age, and he was probably brought to the temple as a tadpole as well so knows no other way! We see how infantile in behaviour Grogu is at 52, so time must slow down for such a long-lived species as these two and hence maybe they are a bit more patient about things and less impulsive as a species. I've never thought about Anakin being emotionally stunted before, but I suppose it makes sense. There is nothing wrong with his intelligence with the actions we see him do, and how ruthlessly efficient he is as Darth Vader later; and as a general he can be considered perhaps the Alexander The Great of Star Wars. However, emotionally, he never matures. Obi-Wan was always there for him and gave him as best guidance as he could; but because he trusts Anakin completely to work through his issues, he is a bit blinded to the fact that Anakin is struggling emotionally, and though the likes of Mace Windu and Yoda are colder to Anakin, they see this and see he isn't mature enough for Masterhood. Another thing we do have to consider, is that since Qui-Gon found him, he is labelled 'The Chosen One', so he thinks one day he'll become this godlike figure who is able to protect everyone around him. When his mother dies, he thinks he has failed her, so sets about making sure he has to become 'stronger' in order that none of the others close to him will perish. Palpatine of course plays on all this, stroking his ego, telling him how strong he will become, and that the Jedi fear him and are jealous of his potential. Funny you brought up Claude Rains, one of my favourite old school character actors, whom I really need to look out more films of his, as I haven't seen The Wolf Man. What he states in it, is almost the issues Andor deals with, with how to fight the Empire. I've also been discussing it on another Patreon with people who are watching Rebels just now as this theme has recently come up there too. Jess is spot on in her post-reaction though, once he choose the path of the Sith, he has to go all in to justify his actions like the killing of Younglings; that for example, the Jedi will step in the way of peace and order after the war, and that he has always had a kind of fascistic approach to the way the galaxy should be governed, so this solidifies these beliefs. Yeah Plo Koon is Filoni's favourite Jedi. Before he got employed by Lucasfilm (which would be right after this film was made) he told stories and showed them pics of him in cosplay as Plo. And when Clone Wars was made, he made him a chief side-character of the show, one who is very much like a Jedi Gandalf. Dunno if you know about the story of the finale of season 2 of Mando as well, where Luke appears to save the day. Though Luke was always going to be the Jedi to show up, Filoni wrote it so that it would be Plo Koon coming back, and they even did designs and costuming for someone to do these scenes. However it was a ruse so that there would be no leaks that the Jedi to come in would be Luke - and it worked a treat. Hehe the whole senate! Robot Star Wars has a lot to answer for! I'm the same as you with the Obi-Wan series. As said there is some significant flaws with some scenes, and one episode; however emotionally it is a tour-de-force for the legacy characters, and really hits hard. I rate it an 8/10, which is probably boosted by slight bias, but there is some true moments of brilliance in it too, which more than make up for some of the dodgier stuff. On rankings, I've recently done it with my top five Jedi, but have never done so for the characters themselves overall. Heck I could probably do a top 50, and Anakin would be in the lower half! Vader though has to be a top fiver though for sure, even excluding nostalgia just because of how popular in media he and R2 were in the 80's.

Anonymous

Another thing to consider with Anakin is that the first nine years of his life, he was a slave on Tatooine, thus, I would imagine he still has unresolved and/or untreated trauma from that that, through no real fault of their own, the other Jedi never really help him process that as they are a touch blind to his emotional struggles such as that. That's a fair point about how when Anakin is brought before the Jedi, the label of the Chosen One is dropped on him from the beginning, which in turn provides the Emperor with plenty to work in his years of manipulation. A lot of the trouble does stem from the death of his mother, and the desire to become powerful enough to prevent any further death of those he cares about. Alexander the Great is an apt comparison. Claude Rains is one of my favorite actors. The Wolf Man is fantastic, and definitely worth seeing. Yeah, the themes of Andor and Rebels are very similar. Jess had such perfect post-reaction thoughts on Anakin, and it was so wonderful to see and hear, particularly after the last two decades of having heard so many people just criticizing and yelling at Anakin without taking any time to even try to understand why he did what he did. I had heard about the Plo Koon subterfuge both in The Mandalorian and to a lesser extent, The Book of Boba Fett. I keep thinking that if I was involved in the show that I'd have called bull on it and I'd have grilled Filoni and Favreau on just how the hell Plo was still alive, exactly. I heard Ming-Na Wen had a similar mentality, and when she saw the on-set actor, she caught the gloved hand and specific lightsaber, recognized both, and said, “That’s Luke!” Robot Chicken’s version of the Emperor is a gift that just keeps on giving. One of the directors of Robot Chicken was on a radio program my brother listens to from time to time. He got asked what he thought was the best Robot Chicken sketch, and he answered that it was the sketch of the Emperor’s phone call. Really, I loved all three of the live-action Star Wars shows this year, each for different reasons. The Book of Boba Fett, one, for Boba himself as he’s in my top ten favorite characters of the franchise. And also, I found it to be so much fun. Not perfect, I had wished that they delved into certain areas more than they did, and I wasn’t overly fond of Mando hijacking the show, though admittedly I liked all of his scenes. Still, I had a blast with it. Andor was science fiction at its best, and as we talked about, felt very John le Carré, and was, I believe, the most dramatically compelling. Obi-Wan was just pure emotion to me. As you say, stumbled a tiny bit, but the emotion and catharsis more than makes up for it. I definitely have a top fifty list for Star Wars characters. Anakin would make the lower half of that, if for no other reason because he is a genuinely compelling character. It is somewhat exhausting ranking favorite Star Wars characters beyond my top fifty as I include from all the media. In my top fifty alone, I have eleven characters from Knights of the Old Republic one and two, chief amongst them, Darth Revan, who’s third behind the Emperor and Darth Vader.