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Our Thoughts on Evan Rachel Wood's #JimHopper Tweets?!? (Patreon)

Published:
2019-08-04 01:00:59
Imported:
2021-04

Content

Thanks for your question, ANDREW NICKERSON!!!

We'll get started on the August Q&A asap, but here's one last straggler from July!

Full Question reads: Hey guys, I know you already answered my question this month, but I just read something that I wanted your opinion on. Maybe for next month? Evan Rachel Wood from Westworld (you know....the rape and murder show?) went on Twitter criticizing Jim Hopper's toxic behavior in Stranger Things. Your thoughts? And Olivia too?

Where do Y'ALL stand on on the subject?!?!  Leave it in the comment box, people!!

Files

Evan Rachel Wood Question

Comments

Eric Horstman

Keep getting a message “an error occurred please try again later” just me?? Oh and ERW is a boss and I’ll defend her to the end. Btw (without not being able to watch the vid) Westworld is not about rape and murder, but about overcoming the violence and degradation afflicted on you and what you do with it. Becoming true to who you are and taking control of your own destiny. It show two sides of the same coin with Delores and Maeve. Of course the show is about way more than that in our society , but as a survivor of sexual abuse and rape myself I’m fucking cheering them on.

Andrew Nickerson

Thanks, guys for your opinions. so, I just want to say, I love both shows and ERW. I only mentioned the "rape and murder" aspect of the show, to point out the far more toxic behavior found on her show. I know the show is not about that and I agree with Eric Horstman on the message of WW. I love ERW's passion and I don't think she is wrong, but there are far better examples to shed light on. Plus, this is the only tweet I've seen of hers, so she might be bringing up a lot of great points I haven't seen.

Jessica McGuire

I agree that there's nothing wrong with a celebrity pointing out the pitfalls of getting involved with toxic people and the differences between tv and real life, but I also agree that she could have chosen a better example. We mostly see Hopper in stressful situations, where people's lives are literally on the line, especially his daughter's. Yeah, he was jealous, but he didn't in any way threaten Joyce or the science teacher and both Mike and El admitted that Hopper was right about the nature of their relationship before he separated them. That it hadn't been a healthy relationship. He lost his temper with Mike when Mike was incredibly rude and disrespectful to Hopper, in his own home, and Hopper just talked and scared the hell out of him, like any good father would do. He didn't actually harm him in any way. He didn't hurt Alexi at all, either, and only hurt the Mayor after the Mayor proved uncooperative and pissed Hopper off with the comment about his daughter. Even then, after the initial slam into the door, he really only threatened to hurt him. As far as the alcoholism is concerned, season 3 spans about a week, concluding on the 4th of July, but Hopper is only shown drunk once during that entire time, when Joyce stood him up. In the first scene he's in for this season, he's shown drinking a single can of beer and eating chips and salsa with it. If you go back to the first episode of the first season, there are beer cans scattered everywhere and he was drinking without having anything to eat. He was also popping pills, which he's never shown doing in the third season. He's acting more like a country "good ole boy" than an alcoholic in the third season and he's not near as violent as he's being made out to be. He's not perfect, at all, but, to me, he's not really toxic, either. First season, yes. This last season? Not so much. Just my thoughts on it.

thereelrejects
>>25415137

Eep! I'm sorry, man!! Is it working any better for you now? I've tested out the link & things appear fine on our end, but I can do some more tweaking if it's still not coming up for you. Also appreciate your insights! Haven't seen past the first season, but I've often found myself curious as to how survivors feel about the show. I remember really loving Maeve and Dolores the first time around.

thereelrejects (edited)

Comment edits

2021-07-15 05:06:39 No problem, man! Appreciate the question and I getcha re: the instances of behavior depicted on WW as opposed to ST. And there is that also - I don't know much about Evan Rachel Wood as a person, but given the show she's on and some of the messages there, I think it does give her POV another interesting layer, at least when it comes to the art side. But yeah, I don't think the overall sentiment is outrageous at all. Arguably Jim Hopper circa S3 wouldn't be a great ideal partner in real-life haha. I think the heart of it is thinking back on the show & seeing if the show, itself, appears to be endorsing his behavior or not.
2019-08-07 22:50:44 No problem, man! Appreciate the question and I getcha re: the instances of behavior depicted on WW as opposed to ST. And there is that also - I don't know much about Evan Rachel Wood as a person, but given the show she's on and some of the messages there, I think it does give her POV another interesting layer, at least when it comes to the art side. But yeah, I don't think the overall sentiment is outrageous at all. Arguably Jim Hopper circa S3 wouldn't be a great ideal partner in real-life haha. I think the heart of it is thinking back on the show & seeing if the show, itself, appears to be endorsing his behavior or not.
>>25420742

No problem, man! Appreciate the question and I getcha re: the instances of behavior depicted on WW as opposed to ST. And there is that also - I don't know much about Evan Rachel Wood as a person, but given the show she's on and some of the messages there, I think it does give her POV another interesting layer, at least when it comes to the art side. But yeah, I don't think the overall sentiment is outrageous at all. Arguably Jim Hopper circa S3 wouldn't be a great ideal partner in real-life haha. I think the heart of it is thinking back on the show & seeing if the show, itself, appears to be endorsing his behavior or not.

thereelrejects (edited)

Comment edits

2021-07-15 05:06:39 Appreciate you sharing your thoughts on the matter! I think sometimes, especially when bingeing, the placement of details and everything can start to feel a little vague for things like this. Even just reading back what you have here I was like, "..oh yeah, it's only a few days or a week at most.." haha But yeah, to your overall point, I think you hit it on the head. Her concern & message is great.. just not an amazing example to drive the point home. And also not accounting, as you pointed out, for the growth over seasons. I feel like part of the point of his character over time has been a sort of rehabilitation. In S1 I feel like he climbs out of a pretty solid depression & awakens his will again.. S2 he's working out all the weird angst of being a secret dad... and then S3 you've got adolescents, and sexual tension, and all that stuff.... and all of these combined with or due to life-and-death situations lol. And I realized during season 3 as well that everyone (at least who's experienced weirdness in Hawkins before) knows the stakes at hand and are pretty much willing to do what they have to, cooperation or no; so I think that can also contribute to a sort of.. unwieldy feeling from certain characters when you zoom out from some of the finer details.
2019-08-07 22:59:35 Appreciate you sharing your thoughts on the matter! I think sometimes, especially when bingeing, the placement of details and everything can start to feel a little vague for things like this. Even just reading back what you have here I was like, "..oh yeah, it's only a few days or a week at most.." haha But yeah, to your overall point, I think you hit it on the head. Her concern & message is great.. just not an amazing example to drive the point home. And also not accounting, as you pointed out, for the growth over seasons. I feel like part of the point of his character over time has been a sort of rehabilitation. In S1 I feel like he climbs out of a pretty solid depression & awakens his will again.. S2 he's working out all the weird angst of being a secret dad... and then S3 you've got adolescents, and sexual tension, and all that stuff.... and all of these combined with or due to life-and-death situations lol. And I realized during season 3 as well that everyone (at least who's experienced weirdness in Hawkins before) knows the stakes at hand and are pretty much willing to do what they have to, cooperation or no; so I think that can also contribute to a sort of.. unwieldy feeling from certain characters when you zoom out from some of the finer details.
>>25424746

Appreciate you sharing your thoughts on the matter! I think sometimes, especially when bingeing, the placement of details and everything can start to feel a little vague for things like this. Even just reading back what you have here I was like, "..oh yeah, it's only a few days or a week at most.." haha But yeah, to your overall point, I think you hit it on the head. Her concern & message is great.. just not an amazing example to drive the point home. And also not accounting, as you pointed out, for the growth over seasons. I feel like part of the point of his character over time has been a sort of rehabilitation. In S1 I feel like he climbs out of a pretty solid depression & awakens his will again.. S2 he's working out all the weird angst of being a secret dad... and then S3 you've got adolescents, and sexual tension, and all that stuff.... and all of these combined with or due to life-and-death situations lol. And I realized during season 3 as well that everyone (at least who's experienced weirdness in Hawkins before) knows the stakes at hand and are pretty much willing to do what they have to, cooperation or no; so I think that can also contribute to a sort of.. unwieldy feeling from certain characters when you zoom out from some of the finer details.

Jessica McGuire
>>25424746

Exactly! I also think that the long time between seasons contributes to people forgetting small details like the things I mentioned, too. Hopper is one of my favorite characters and he is not an alcoholic, by the definition of the word. He is neither dependent on nor addicted to alcohol, or he wouldn't be able to stop with just one beer or a couple of shots of vodka. He didn't buy any beer at the 7-11 and apparently didn't even look for any alcohol at Murray's until they found out about the opening of the gate. That's further evidence against him being a true alcoholic. As for the violence, you make a good point about all of them being willing to do what they have to. Hopper is the most aggressive of the group, but, technically, Nancy, Jonathan and Eleven are all more violent than he is this season. There's also the fact that he's the chief of police. It's literally his job to protect the entire town and its people and has been for years. When he was consumed by depression, that probably didn't mean very much to him but sober and with a daughter to protect? His argument with the mayor, on behalf of the protesters, indicate that he's feeling at least some of the weight of that responsibility. As you pointed out, the character has evolved quite a lot over the three seasons.

thereelrejects
>>25424746

Ahh yeah, there's definitely that too. Plus all the other things there are to watch and get distracted by between seasons. For me, I wound up watching most of the series in the weeks leading up to the release of Season 3, so a lot of it was pretty fresh in my mind - save for exactly where certain events fall in terms of specific episodes 😅 But yeah, generally it does seem like there's a whole lot going on in context that sorta works against her particular Hopper argument. That's a good point as well- his being the chief & thus responsible for protecting the town. Especially when he's roughing up the mayor - at that point it seems pretty clear (as I recall) that he's involved with something nasty before Hopper really lets him have it. I tend to find problematic characters interesting partially for this reason - so many ways to look at them & ways to consider what the overall piece might be saying about them.

Jessica McGuire
>>25424746

That's actually one of the things that I like about this show. So many shows have their characters black and white, like the mayor or the Russians in Stranger Things. They're either good guys or bad guys. This show really likes to take the characters that you want to dislike, like Steve in season one or Billy in season two, and turn them in to people that you can at least sympathize with, if not actually like. That's also one of the reasons that I like anime as much as I do. Far more of their characters are grey than you find in most American shows.