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Comments on Patreon (Patreon)

Published:
2021-02-18 22:00:29
Imported:
2023-07

Content

Hey everyone -- I'm excited to see some lively discussion on the latest videos here. (Duncan and Garnett will do that.) As you've noticed, Patreon doesn't have a great interface for handling conversations like these or even longer comments. 

So if you have a long comment, please write it in a separate word document it first with paragraphs. You can then copy and paste it in and the spacing will be preserved...this way the rest of us can read it more easily.

Thanks!

Comments

Anonymous

While certainly not a new take, I wonder what the optics of Garnett would be if he came into the league 10 years later. It's such a shame that we never saw him on a great team at his peak. That defensive switch-ability and speed is just phenomenal. I'm personally of the opinion that Ganrett and Duncan are about equal, with Duncan being better in his era, and Garnett being better suited for an era like this one, and it's just a shame to me that people brush over Garnett when talking about all time greats. If paired with a great playmaking guard, or surrounded with shooting, the discussion around him could be much closer to top 10 all time. The other thing that really shows is how portable his skills are. His skillset, even reduced to their most basic levels, are valuable to every team. He never needed a team built around him, all he needed was some form of competency (and a lack of injury) around him.

Mike C

Drop video. Me ape. Me need video

Anonymous
>>53948861

I've been arguing against Garnett in the last week but Garnett is already in the top 10 range. I feel like 10 being the basis of the decimal system puts too much pressure on the number. I have him in my tier 3 group and that should be top 15* at worst to begin with. *: I believe 15 is too low for many people active around Ben's contents but I also have pretty high regards for Oscar Robertson, Jerry West. With the usual 11 and with Big O, West and KG, that's 14 and being #14 in such club is not a bad thing. (I also have pretty high regards for Moses Malone which is pretty unusual for the internet I think. That's my top 15 and all tier 1&2&3 players.) --- There are 4 major reasons why I have Duncan ahead of Garnett by a tier though. - Duncan's offensive (especially scoring) performances at his best is unmatched by Garnett. You can look at my latest comment on Garnett's episode about that, I shouldn't flood here with more of the same. The gist is Duncan had more scoring in him than what you can find on his BBRef profile page (which looks comparable to Garnett) and it is proven with his track record. - When people mention portability it usually means "a player on a random team". However, when the topic is someone historic, I usually think "a player on a random team in a random season". It's usually assumed that portability is only pro-modern thinking, i.e. assumption only goes as "what if he played today". But historical figures, it should be applied to all possible eras. And while it's pretty obvious that Garnett's skills are more valuable than Duncan's skills for the 2010s and the 2020s ball, for majority of the game's history, Duncan's skills are more valuable. Duncan was better for their era and the prior eras as well. - To compare primes, I usually look at top 10 or 12 seasons between two players, not just for sheer numbers, also for who'd have the more top heavy results. While 2002&2003 Duncan and 2003&2004 Garnett are very very close to each other, the rest has Duncan as the better prime. - Garnett's longevity is way better than the casual perception but his seasons after 2007-08 were pretty injury riddled bar 2011-12 season. That's another thing to consider. --- I think I should remind that I have pretty high regards for Garnett. Just mentioned the tiebreakers between him and Timmy for me. Cheers.

Anonymous
>>53948861

That's fair. For me it more comes down to how terribly the Wolves were constructed vs how well the Spurs were constructed. Duncan had the better career, which is an inarguable point. To me though, I feel like (ironically) both player might have performed better than each other in the others respective team, with Duncan's scoring ability heling the wolves, while pairing Ganrett with Robinson would just be utterly unfair on defense, along with letting him play with some modicum of shooting. Either way, it's all speculative because we only ever got to see Ganrett with a good team later in his career, while Duncan played on one every year of his career. This is also overlooking the leader Duncan is, which is why if I had to chose, I'd always pick Duncan as the better player, even if by just a hair.

Anonymous
>>53948861

In that "swap them" scenario, it's quite forgotten that how NBA ready Tim Duncan was and Gregg Popovich wasn't the Pop we know until the mid '00s. When Popovich stepped down to coach, he was under immense pressure and Duncan being that NBA ready and being that coachable brought success to SA right away and really helped Pop's grip on the team. I don't think Garnett would do such impact in Duncan's first 2 seasons in the league. (Also I think Robinson's and Garnett's play styles and strong points overlap too much for them to succeed on that level in the low post era playoffs basketball.) --- &gt; while Duncan played on one every year of his career. I don't agree with this. The Spurs were considered title contenders from 2000-01 to 2003-04 just like the Cavs in 2008-09 and 2009-10. Their superstar was that good but not the team. I'm not saying those Spurs teams entirely sucked but they were an average team, not a good one. Prime to prime, it's no debate that Duncan had more and better structured help for sure. I chimed in back because that hard transition period in the first half of the '00s is usually overlooked in Duncan's case. The team was going from old washed up players to young and inexperienced players, and Duncan carried them real hard. Ben mentions in Duncan's video how hard Duncan grinded it out in his peak seasons but that was what asked of him from Pop. Pop's offensive system was basically dumping the ball on Timmy to create something. If you watch a game from 2002 playoffs and then 2007 playoffs, you'd see what I'm talking about clear as day. He was still taking his time on the ball when he wanted to score but his facilitating priorities are not comparable, at all.