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Angel S04E17 - Inside Out FULL REACTION (Patreon)

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2019-04-04 18:56:48
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OneHub link: https://ws.onehub.com/files/r9q84dg7

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Comments

Anouar

I felt so bad for connor.

Titan Gaming

given the expression afterward... was it "did you really just hit Fred"? haha... trust me... we know all about this and whats to come. i had to skip all this shit just to get the end hah. which lead to confusion, and the rewatch to figure out what happened

Brandon Wiesner

I won't be able to watch it until later but yeah, season 4. I don't think there's much debate about it being the worst Angel season.

Zoot!

It could be worse, Riley could show up!

Anouar
>>21473289

That's you're opinion, myself actually like this season very much, just like many other people i know, and others that watched the show since the beginning.

Vincent Valentin

Don't worry it gets better! This was definitely a low point though.

Will Crow

Just be glad Season 5 is coming soon. That will make all of this worth it.

Second_Strike

In Connor's defense, his character does have a reason to be stupid and naive. His maturity level is essentially that of a child. Not that it makes his character any less frustrating to watch. Also I don't dislike this arc as much as everybody else, it just could have be done like 1000 times better. It's an attempt at a decent storyline that was just done terribly lol.

chris bullers

Im secretly a cat! Thats going to stick with me.

stressbean

so glad you are almost finished with this season. by far the worst one in Angel. Season 5 is my favorite

Nick Velasquez

I had the hardest time with this season...but I feel like from here out season 4 gets better. If I remember correctly

James MacDonald

"So Cordelia gave birth to a black woman". Legit laughed out loud at that line.

Will Crow

Some of this upcoming arc is good. Not this episode though... Oh boy...

MittenCrab

ASR: "Here's a little game though, can you spot the moment that I knew I was over it? There is a phrase I said in this reaction." When you confessed to being Miss Kitty Shantastico?

Spencer Williams

Meh. You'll get over it. This is the one episode that even someone like myself, who likes Season 4 a lot, has a few issues with. Funny enough though, the ending isn't one of them. I quite like the upcoming arc.

Dana

I feel like if you don't like something, you'll find reasons to justify why you don't like it to the point that you won't even consider an alternative. It's perfectly understandable, Conner as a character is supposed to be this way. The whole thing with Cordelia is supposed to upset you. It's fine. It's human. But I feel like you take things very personal sometimes, to point that you can't look at things objectively. I'm not trying to call you out or anything. I love your reactions. I'm just trying to offer a perspective you may not have considered.

Dana
>>21478013

For example, you say Conner is irridemable in the moment that he choses "Cordelia" and starts dragging the girl to her death. Because he's a souled human (sorta) and he's chosing to kill an innocent, right? Sounds fair. But consider Faith, who has is also a souled human (sorta), and how many innocent people has she killed? Yet she is one of your favourites, right? (also one of mine, just so you know) But because you LIKE her character, you can look past that. See what I mean?

Fly on the Wall
>>21474668

This is actually my favorite season and 5 is my least favorite. So at the very least it does show how different the two are.

CaptainNice

And now you know why you needed to see some Firefly before getting to this ep. Zoe is Cordy's daughter, that's a fine twist. Indeed, Connor is now irredeemable. And Skip was evil and is dead.

Jason Veevaert

I feel for the kid, I mean, what happened was terrible, though I am a big believer in chances (Faith, Angel, Spike, Jayne from Firefly, Root from Person of Interest) and I am willing to let bygones be bygones if they actually become better.

Sam Boettcher

This is why I love your reactions. They are very honest and real, and most of us felt the same way when we first saw it too. It may sound bad, but watching you suffer through it made me smile, as it validates most other reactions to the craziness too. You'll make it through it, and Season 5 will make you very happy.

Kelly Marie

I know Connor shits you, he shits me as well but i feel sorry him. He got taken away as a baby, raised in a demon dimension, manipulated to hate his real father, manipulated by Cordy etc. All the kid wants is to be loved but he is so hurt that he can't see that he already is. Oh and also, the woman who Cordy gave birth to played Bree in TVD season 1 :)

Juan Torres

Geez Shan I know this seasons been rough for you with the whole Cordelia and Connor thing,which I despised as well and nearly got me off Angel, but I never knew it was “I miss Riley” bad....sheesh! 😝

Ariel17

Sorry you felt turned off by this episode ASR, but I’m in the camp that this is actually a really good season, and in retrospect this episode doesn’t bother me that much (again, benefit of hindsight). Just give yourself some time after the season to think about what you really enjoyed the most from this season :-) But I also wanna say how I loved some details in this ep, like the contrast of Darla dressed in white and Cordy dressed in black, playing angel and devil on Connors shoulders, also Vincent Kartheiser’s acting in those scenes was great, you can see the anguish of his lost soul. Honestly felt bad for him, cause he really doesn’t know his mother at all, just her name and that she was a vampire (no home videos on Quortoth) and when he came back to Earth he hated Angel with a vengeance (all cause of Holtz). Only then to be manipulated by not-so-real Cordy, which only fed his paranoia and mistrust of others except her, and provided the strongest bond Connors ever had with another human being: intimacy and having a child together. It’s not difficult to understand how he is so easily manipulated by Cordy I think. But I also really enjoy this episode cause of a cool theory I read a long time ago, but I can’t explain now cause it may be kinda spoilery so I will wait till the season is over :-) Hope you enjoy the rest of the season and season 5 though!

Lisa Irv

Man, this week consisted of my two least favorite episodes of the season. I was cracking up at your reaction to this one though so at least I got something new out of it. I can't help but feel for Connor, even after all of this. I have a soft spot for that unlucky kid.

FernWithy

There is just nothing to say about this. The whole retro-fitting everything into it... I choose to believe Skip was lying, end of story. I refuse to give this story arc that much power. It's like a really tacky fanfic. (And I say that as someone who has written a tacky fic or two.) Connor was so badly written this season. I feel like he wasn't supposed to come off as an idiot, but yes... he did. I think we're supposed to pick up on him having been emotionally abused and gaslighted all his life, and this is the crowning moment of his destruction. And I can see the structure there--it's textbook AbPsych (if somewhat dated). He was kidnapped, raised by his kidnapper, emotionally traumatized for his entire childhood, and he recognizes manipulation and control as "real" love... yeah, again, textbook. But since we didn't see any of it (since it happened during the time skip), there's no emotional connection for us. We didn't see bright and happy little Connor sent off into the hellscape wilderness and come back just a little more scarred every time. It just comes off as "Come on, really?" It's one thing to be <i>able</i> to fill in the blanks. It's something else entirely to be <i>expected</i> to do so if you mean to follow the story. It was like they had a list of things they decided to do come hell or high water, and it didn't matter that the pre-lim work on the characters doing it was never done. Grrr. Maybe I'll take on Angel 4 on my fix-it schedule after I finish Buffy 6. ;p It's almost over, and it will get more enjoyable from this point out.

Brandon Wiesner

I'm stuck between "but why are you such a fucking idiot?" and "you're irredeemable trash!" I'm pretty sure it's one of those though.

John Boehmer

I think you are being too harsh towards Conner. Remember, he was lied to every day by Holtz in an attempt to turn him into a weapon he could use against Angel. He has been programmed to hate Angel and I don't think that one year is really enough time to undo all that damage. Conner wants to be able to love and trust Angel but he can't. And now the woman that he has fallen in love with (his first love BTW) is using all that to manipulate him into doing want she wants. Conner isn't stupid. He questions Cordy at length but because he loves her she is able to sway him easily. I'm not really a big fan of the character but in this instance I feel really sorry for him.

chris bullers

Im secretly a cat! That one will stick with me.

Bixgirl1

Conner. God, that boy. So frustrating, I agree. I try to remember the sheer psychological damage he's undergone and how malleable he is because of that, but fucking hell does he make it hard sometimes. :/ Loved Darla in this episode though. She's always been a favorite of mine.

Melazond

Ah ha ha haaaa. I know exactly when it was!! That made me laugh out loud!

chris bullers

I mean this whole arc sucks, but regarding the ending. Think of it as Cordy gave birth to a tentacle demon who was possessing her, which then chose to take the form of a black lady. Its not really Cordys biological child in the regular way that would make it weird.

Bisibia

Connor sucks... he's not just frustrating within the story, but I also just don't want to see him on the screen. That being said, it doesn't really hurt the season for me. I still think the story is fantastic... I love the whole arc with the Beast, then Angelus, then Faith, and now we get to know why everything is happening the way it is. The storytelling, imo, is fantastic. And I was never the biggest Cordy fan anyway, so her being all evil didn't bother me... it actually kept me curious the whole season, wanting to know what was going on. I also really love Darla being back, even just for a moment... and I really think the rest of the season is some of the best work the Angel team has done.

Dennis Bryant

I have to say, watching you take out your earbud, and almost step away.... Was right there too when I was watching this arc as it broadcast. This season is notably the "worst" season, just beacause the story arc made people really dislike or hate several choices that were made for the story. There are good episodes, and good character points, but overall thie season was a very dicey story.

Bruce Trogdon

I think that might have been the most interesting lyrics to the Angel theme yet, but I'm still trying to make out some of the lines. Speaking of interesting, About 90% less interaction between Connor and Not!Cordy would have made a big difference, IMO. Repetition is important to keep Connor in line but off-screen repetition would have been better. When Darla appeared did you make the (possible) connection with what's going on on BtVS? Might that have been Darla, or might it have been First Evil trying to stop a competing apocalypse? I think Skip believed what he said but maybe he WAS being duped and Gina Torres simply took advantage of certain events for her own ends. Really though, this story line was set up in “Judgement” (2-1) where powerful beings from another dimension were shown to be making rules and setting up hoops for humans to jump through. There was nothing Angel could do about that but the woman needed help which was something Angel DID have control over. He could help.

Allan Cornett

I love this season because it does make people uncomfortable. Great shows cause powerful reactions positive and negative. I love this so much more than a series that makes me go “meh”. Just remember ASR it wasn’t Cordy and her child is NOT a black woman

Katherine Thoreson
>>21484233

ooohhh I can't wait to see what this theory is now. You give a good analysis of what this episode is. This whole season is one that you have to get through once, think about it, rewatch it a couple of times, and then you finally start to go.....okay.....i'm understanding this more now and can see more sides and layers than I could the first time around.

Chaotic Cam

"Potato peel" "I miss Riley" I'm dead.

Mike Woodcock

And we thought Angel's baby grew up fast . . . Must run in the family.

Mike Woodcock

"The final score can't be rigged. I don't care how many players you grease, that last shot always comes up a question mark. But here's the thing—you never know when you're taking it. It could be when you're duking it out with the Legion of Doom, or just crossing the street deciding where to have brunch. So you just treat it all like it was up to you—the world in the balance—'cause you never know when it is." Gunn is not just the muscle.

Emma goldsbrough

I think I pass out why you said you missed Riley, it must of be really bad for you, if you had to say that you poor thing. I'm not a fan of season 4.

Clara V.

At the very least we are finally at the point where we get to talk about Cordy in any way without massive spoilers, because I feel like a lot of us have been holding this collective breath since you started the season and now we can all share our feelings about what happened at last. Always a silver lining, right?

Lex

I've said it elsewhere previously but I'll say it again for posterity - there's a good video where Charisma Carpenter talks about some of the stuff that happened this season that I think is essential to watch if, like me, you were mad at what happened to her character this season. There's also an excellent essay, but both the video and the essay contain spoilers for later episodes so I'll wait to link them - I'll maybe post them in the spoiler section of the discord some time before season 5.

Ron Fehr

Darla's quote "I feel the good in you" reminded me of Luke Skywalker's quote to Darth Vader. A role reversal though. Son to father instead of mother to son.

Ron Fehr

All I can say, Shan, is you'll have to watch the rest to understand what happened at the end of this episode.

Nicolas Cardillo

I get why u get mad at conor but that's the way he was written down. He is a half demon human child that live all his life on a hell dimension only talking to other human that only through him to fight with his instincts n hate Angelus. he has been on the human world for a few month u can expect him to understand Manipulation that easy. i bet he doesn't even know what sarcasm is n u what him to know everything that is good n bad that civilisations has. we that have live here can even understand each other whit different cultures but u expect him to be socially capable of understanding everything. gun just got play last episode a 5 year old can play conor like a poppet since she would had more social experien. a kid can convince adult to do thing for them because they play the innocent, cute, sad face to trigger our empathy n manipulate adult that have no experience with children. im surprised how adap he is to our wold thats more shoking.

Timotey Kuhn

Yes indeed. Inside Out is a very good PIXAR movie. :D

Timotey Kuhn

At 9:12....while there definitely is a great deal of good in this season, this particular episode, and that moment in particular , I honestly can't blame you in the slightest for what you were likely feeling in that moment. What Cordy &amp; Connor had to work with in terms of writing was pretty howlingly bad soap opera level bad.

JEREMY SCHULTZ

8:50, I have now seen Shan rage quit.

Bisibia

I gotta make an argument for Connor being naive... Dude spent 16 years in a hell dimension with one other person who was actually just a guy that kidnapped him. That dude is dead, and he's stuck alone now with the one guy that his fake dad always taught him was an evil monster. The kid only trusts one person now... Cordy. He knows nothing else. He doesn't know how this world works or how people lie... Makes sense to me that the beautiful woman who's taken care of him since he's been back, who is also carrying his child, is the one he'd be most likely to listen to.

JoDaNa81

Even though it didn't ruin the season for me, I can see where people come from with the Cordy/Connor. I wasn't really a fan of it either..between that &amp; some of the Buffy/Spike stuff on there, definitely some stuff to dislike that year.

Rachael
>>21486470

I get what you're saying, but for me, Connor is abused and broken down so much in S4 by Cordelia, and also Angel -- unpopular opinion, but Angel is being a bad father -- that I couldn't take any scenes of Connor being tortured in Quor'toth. Connor was raised in a hell dimension by a vengeful sociopath intent on turning Connor into a monster to complete his (Holtz) vengeance against Angelus. That's all we need to know. Connor was raised to be a tool and has no sense of self. I do not understand why people are so hostile to an abused, brainwashed child who is clearly motivated to do good.

Tammy L. Faulkner

"I miss Riley" 😆 I almost peed myself from laughing so hard... I even had to replay it to make sure that was what I heard. Yeah... I really hated the Conner storyline. It put season 4 in last place for me. My personal order in likes for Angel is 5,2,1,3,4. I know Conners character's all mixed and all but it was just way too frustrating to watch the first time around... Still is. But, that actor did a GREAT job with the character, can't really see a lot of ppl playing that character.

Anonymous
>>21800065

As much as I didn't like Connor, I wouldn't say that his character ruined the season for me. There were some plotlines (not gonna mention it anymore) that just didn't work well for his character. My personal order of faves would be Angel season 2, 3, 4, 5, then 1. lol

SparkleIsHere

I love how the only she noticed is that the baby was black