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ATEEZ REACTION: VIP Winner Request [Pungja's Laundry - Hongjoong & Mingi] | Ateez on Ssuply (Wooyoung, San, Seonghwa & Jongho) (Patreon)

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2023-01-19 20:00:03
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These two interviews were SO FUNNY!!! I couldn't stop laughing at Mingi, he was cracking me up the entire time hahahaha 

What are your thoughts on the Korean hierarchy system? I really struggle to agree with the thought of having to show more respect to someone just because they are older or more successful. I believe everyone should be treated equally - all with respect! Just because you may be more successful doesn't mean you should be treated differently.  HOWEVER I do understand that I have these views purely because I didn’t grow up having to focus on treating people differently. I was always told “respect your elders and be polite” and that’s as far as it went.

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Piwi
>>99997818

thank you @hana.. (sorry i forgot to type your name) hugs all around.. :) by the way, @melanie, was the video you watched a cut-down version? The editors may have cut that part - but Jongho shared his experience from a different company where they pick a date to get them in line and trainees had to bow 90 degrees 100 times. When they need to use the practice room they need to bow to all the staff one by one at 90 degrees or 100 times. Or am I just tripping??

Piwi
>>99997818

definitely in this video. i watched this 5 times, 6 including yours. :) haha probably the editors felt that they need to although Jongho's intention was not to throw shade on the company.

Kpopiana

in my culture (Nigerian but I was born, raised and live in the UK) respecting your elders is such a big thing whether they disrespect you or not, you still have to show them respect. But as you grow older, you learn to realise that its not just about respecting your elders, its about respecting everyone and that respect IS reciprocal. And after I reached a certain age, best believe I only respect those who respect me. I could give a damn about you being older or more successful, you're just another human being to me.

isabella

I just saw your reaction to this now but I agree with the comments. ATEEZ is notorious for being very respectful and very particular with manners. They’ve always said in their interviews that their standard of how they look at people is based on their morals. According to san, “Even if the person has a cool suit on, it’s hard for me to like them if they are rude to others. There may be achievements that can be achieved in a short period of time but because morals cannot be made overnight, I think more effort and time is needed.” -Singles Magazine Interview and Yunho said this as well “Definition of cool: When one is at the top, that’s when you see one’s true identity. The ones who remain humble at the top are the ones who are truly cool.” So i get 100% why ATEEZ are so particular with how people respect them regardless of age and status because they expect to be reciprocated in the same manner. They just highlighted the treatment between sunbaes and hoobaes because the concept of the show is about social boomers but in general/reality, there is no doubt that ateez respects everyone regardless of age and status.

Muyaho

풍자 (poongja) is my favourite so online content creator. Honestly anything she's on is hilarious. Glad you chose this, came right after I saw the notification. I was like Poongja!!

Chloe Park

Oh god as a gen z korean, i hate Ggondaes with all my heart XD The hierarchy system isn't that bad as long as you keep your morals straight. It comes and goes, level of strictness to the system depends on the environments and situations (stricter in terms of workplace, especially in kmedia/entertainment-industry, military, department of law & justice, and medical field). If you get to know that someone more, and if that someone is okay for you to say less formally, you don't have to be that strict with the rule. We first really experience the system in school, especially from around middle school, where you get to learn you should bow to sunbaes, and receive bows from hoobaes even though you are just a year older/younger. But yes, everyone should be treated equally, but this "hierarchy system" is not about the basic human rights, it's just to emphasize on the respect more. Ggondaes are the newly made (mockery) nicknames for sunbaes who use this system in a wrong way (mainly for their benefit). But it's not that bad. lol.

Muyaho

Every society has hierarchies. A mixture of social capital distributed by age, gender, ethnicity or age. It just so happens that in Korea ( and in my country as well in West Africa) the age based hierarchy is more palpable than in other places. It's about social cues and morals; like it's agreed upon and most people learn that you don't use banmal with someone you don't know because that's disrespectful and even more if the person is older than you, so whether you think this system is morally justified or not the act of not respecting that rule is a conscious decision of disrespect. Also 꼰대 is not exactly boomer. Boomer is an already existing word that describes a specific demographic of people in the US born during the baby boom after WWII. But ggondae although it's often associated with older people who like to nag and be nosy it can be anyone who is especially attached to socials rules. That's why they translated it to social boomer instead of just boomer, to show the difference.

Melanie Lillis
>>99978701

Ahhhh ok!!! It’s great to hear your opinion on this actually. I for one LOVE that respect is engrained! It’s something that (I can only speak for my country) is heavily needed. The lack of respect from the younger generation in particular (speaking from experience as an ex-teacher) is SO BAD. I am an extremely chill teacher and have never yelled at a student, but I have had kids yell at me, swear at me, try to intimidate me by standing over me, one student slapped me in the face - you name it and I have seen it. I think that having such a high focus on respect could definitely do my country good that’s for sure 😅 But let’s take idols as an example… I just can’t understand the whole “respect your sunbaes” thing. Because why? Why do you need to respect someone, bow 90 degrees, speak to them formally (even if they are younger) just because they debuted first? What makes them more special? What if the hoobaes are actually 100 times more talented? Shouldn’t they just equally respect each other? I mean…. I don’t know. I just remember watching this YouTube video of an ex idol talking about bad experiences he had with sunbae’s - but those people must have been Ggondaes 😂😂😂 I also think about my own experiences of “respecting your elders” and there are some older people who are absolute wankers and don’t deserve one inch of my respect LOL! I have always lived by the rule of treat people how you would like to be treated but know when someone doesn’t deserve your respect. I just don’t think I could give someone my respect if they weren’t showing the same back to me. It would be very hard 🙈 I’m just airing out my thoughts though, I totally respect different cultural differences of course ❤️

Chloe Park
>>99978701

So in artistry, Sunbae is a HUGE deal. This matters no matter how successful you are now with lesser years of being an artist. Because we respect mainly focusing on their dedications, and years and years of experience sunbaes have built for them. Seventeen's dino is now considered one of the youngest daesunbaes out there. He is younger than hongjoong, Chan, and many other globally talented artists. Your question actually shocked me because I think I would bow even harder considering how younger and longer he has been in the industry and he is just 24. It's like, no other boy groups can beat bigbang or tvxq in terms gaining respect, even bts and exo, who have gained popularity across the world, because without their foundations and legendary pathways/efforts, the 3rd and 4th gen wouldn't be able to open their wings as much as they could have. It's actually being extremely rude having such mindset as "im more talented then you are, so why are they gaining more respect than i am? Just because they are sunbaes?". If a hoobae had that attitude towards me and let's say they do have more talent than I do, everyone in the room including myself would've been very offended by it lol. Remember, becoming a kpop idol or an actor is a loooooooong journey. Even the trainees have hierarchy to themselves, so why such newbie, who have just debuted would have such provokable manner to a person who has finished trainee years way before them, AND has been in the industry for years. Even if you are more successful, you still have more to learn in terms of their situational judgement skills, how to act in diff ways if something happens like stage accidents, etc. Now I feel like Im just repeating everything all over again lmfao.

Slove 1

It's really refreshing to see lgbtq representation in Korean media and the fact that ateez came on a smaller show hosted by a transwoman was really nice to see, and they were hilarious together! Also the north korea analogy was actually on point and actually a simpler way to explain the two universes haha 😂😂

Melanie Lillis
>>99978701

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh right!!!!!! I didn’t take into consideration the years and years it takes as a trainee. That makes sense actually and has given me a completely different perspective. I’m not sure if you know, but what if there is an “idol to be” that has been a trainee for longer than someone who was a trainee who has now debuted? Like say someone has been a trainee for 10 years but has yet to debut, however another person has been a trainee for a year and has already debuted! Does the respect still fall on the person who has debuted even though they have trained for less time? I guess it would right?

Melanie Lillis
>>99979116

Oh I totally understand the whole “respect someone you don’t know” and even “respect your elders”. 10000% get that and I always show respect to people I am meeting for the first time and those who I don’t know very well (I show respect to my friends too but obviously in a more comfortable way). My issue is more for those who expect respect but don’t give it back. But I am getting a lot of different perspectives on this now which is great 🥰

Melanie Lillis
>>99981252

Ok I wasn’t sure what her story was actually, I didn’t want to comment. But that’s AWESOME! I love that SO MUCH 😍

Hana

As an asian, I can understand that the culture built around respect is worlds apart from the way a non-asian views it, especially if you're primarily an english speaker. Respect towards elders is so inbuilt in our language and mannerisms that it's less about putting elders on a pedestal and more about showing that you don't treat your culture flippantly and you are educated on social cues. For example, someone older than me can be an asshole. But when I'm speaking to them I will still use the honorifics according to their experience or age. And I will express my disdain towards them through words without stripping off the honorifics or without losing my culture and education. And these honorifics are not so much dependent on how rich and successful you are, but simply on how much elderly or experienced you are. Like if you told me to treat someone differently because they are successful I would roll my eyes, but if you asked to show respect because someone is older then okay I would understand. And all that is also usually dialed down when you get to know people and get closer to them.

Melanie Lillis
>>99981811

Completely understand that for sure 😍 and my views weren’t necessarily around respecting elders who are 10+ years older than you (as we do that too). It was more around the fact that you have to respect someone who is merely 1 year older (could even just be a month older if they were born in December and other in January). It’s just wild to me 🙈

Melanie Lillis
>>99981811

Don’t get me wrong, respect is IMPORTANT and everyone should always lead with respect. But if someone doesn’t reciprocate it just because they are older, that’s when I don’t agree

Chloe Park
>>99978701

In that case, the person who made the debut will gain more respect. Because remember: Trainee<<<<<<<<<artists

Melanie Lillis
>>99978701

Ah ok! So interesting 🙈 it’s such a fascinating world and just so far off what I am used to. Like don’t get me wrong, I understand the Korean culture in regards to this, and whilst I do love a lot of it; I just struggle to agree with some aspects of it (purely just because it’s not what I grew up with). Thanks for informing me on certain areas 😍❤️

Hana

That being said if you went to Asia and messed up the honorifics I'm sure no one would mind because they know you didn't grow up with it!

isa

I think part of why ateez takes it quite seriously is because they have always made it a point for themselves to be super respectful to others, always a 90 degree bow and often even doing keunjeol (the big bow, like actually getting all the way down on your knees w your head on the ground) bows to atiny to show us their gratitude, because being respectful and humble is very important to them

Melanie Lillis
>>99983202

Absolutely! And I love that so much. Where I was coming from was more to the point of showing respect and receiving it back. As long as the sunbaes are showing respect back to the hoobaes then I agree. But if the respect isn’t reciprocated then I don’t know how I feel about it 🙈

isa
>>99983202

oh yeah I know! I too really dislike unreciprocated respect, but knowing how ateez themselves act it makes sense to me, it's not them demanding any sort of undeserved respect they just kinda want people to return the energy I guess

StarsForMars

I think what they mean by social boomer is like having that same kind of attitude or doing/saying things that a boomer would do/say even though they are not actually boomers age wise. Like having an old school kind of view of things. Wooyoung jokes about that a lot like saying "back in my day" when his day was not that long ago lolol. Also regarding the respect thing, I'm not Korean so don't know all the ins and outs, but I always understood it as being based on experience, not success or money. If you've spent more time in something than your peers, then you are more senior in comparison so that affects how someone with less experience would greet and talk to you. And vice versa. It's just acknowdeging the senority when you're not on casual speaking terms. So Ateez is basically saying it's a bit impolite for someone newer in the industry to greet them with less formality than is socially expected as it shows a level of casualness that Ateez hasn't allowed them to have with them yet. It's all just good manners regardless of whether you morally respect the person or not.

Olivia H

yeah, that was why they were chosen for this show. bc ateez always use the highest level of respect for everyone regardless of status and they were saying that it should be reciprocated. they're 'social boomers' in that case. their whole motto is even if you're younger than us, we will still be treating you respectfully and you should to

Melanie Lillis
>>99986743

Love that! And agree in this regard. I think I initially took what Wooyoung was saying the wrong way if I’m being honest. But as long as the respect is reciprocated then I agree 10000%

Maz Colyer

Is anyone else having problems with this video constantly freezing and having to skip on to get it to work again 🫠

Melanie Lillis
>>99986479

Yes yes I fully agree in regards to everything you said. I think I didn’t come across in the right way. I more meant, I am all for showing respect to EVERYONE if that respect is reciprocated. But if you have to treat a sunbae with respect even if they treat you poorly, that’s shitty. But I do get the hierarchy etc.. there are just certain elements that are interesting to me because it’s not what I’m used to xx

Kiara

I think the way that Wooyoung and San meant is not just like "talk to me like this bc I'm your sunbae" type of way. They are notoriously nice and respectful to everyone in the industry new and old and have been seen in video folding themselves in half to greet everyone. So I get why it would be annoying to have someone barely even nod to you when they pass you lmao(especially when they know better, it's not a foreign concept to them, and them doing that even in school would be considered rude). Also politeness there and politeness to other are just so different so I guess I can see why it's hard for some to fully grasp it. Nodding in some countries is polite while in others it isn't.

Maz Colyer

Yay got it working in the end lol I was brought up to respect the elders and always use my please and thank yous and that's how I also bring my son up. I don't think anyone who is higher up should have the respect if they can't give it. I'm still learning about the korea culture it's very confusing to me.

Melanie Lillis
>>99990735

No totaaaaally get that for sure! Equal respect is so important and I do understand where they were coming from. I was more meaning, I don’t get why people should just automatic expect someone to show them respect just because they debuted first. HOWEVER reading through comments, I now take that back! I didn’t really realise how important the hierarchy is within the entertainment world 🙈

StarsForMars
>>99986479

I think it also is their way to be professional as well. Like you wouldn’t walk in on your first day at work and go up to your boss and say “hey what’s up bro”, which is kind of what Wooyoung was getting at. Even if they were a shitty boss, it’s just not professional, because it’s a work environment and there are other people around you as well. Reminds me how Seonghwa said once that even though he’s okay with the younger members speaking casually with him in the dorms and in private, he still appreciates that they revert back to “Hyung” in public because they respect him, and it shows that they are well mannered. So it can be very situational too. Also like how Ateez are casual with SKZ as friends but if they were on a program together still refer to them as sunbae bc they are their senior in their industry. I guess a good anology would be rather than having to earn respect, everyone is (or should be) respected and casualness is earned.

Melanie Lillis
>>99986479

Absolutely! When Wooyoung was talking I think I was thinking of it as “you should show me respect” (but then me imagining the other person being high and mighty and not giving that same respect back). But it is absolutely expected to be respectful in that way - especially when you are new.

Melanie Lillis
>>99990919

Totally “respect your elders” is something I grew up with too! And to just be a good person and be polite to people. But the fact that people can automatically get given more respect than you just because of x, y or z, is still also very knew to me 🙈

vron
>>99990735

Yeah not just in the entertainment industry. It's something that's basically in our blood. There's always gonna be pros and cons one sees in a culture, but yeah... glad you got to see the comments! And have you heard of the insult "you're such a boomer" ? coz thats not even a korean thing! social boomer just refers to being "old school" in terms of societal rules and whatnot (like those ppl who look down upon certain groups of ppl)

Melanie Lillis
>>99990735

I actually never knew what a boomer meant 🤣🤣🤣🤣 LOL!!!! I thought a boomer was an older person acting younger, like using the lingo HAHA Omg 🤦🏼‍♀️ But yeah it’s a hard one for someone to comprehend when you didn’t grow up with those cultural rules that’s all, so it’s great to hear opinions from Koreans 😍❤️

Kiara
>>99990735

I'm glad everyone in the comments was able to express their opinion so coherently and nicely. We love a healthy comment section! ❤️❤️❤️

Piwi

I wanted to share this because this episode hit me too. :) I don't consider myself a "boomer" but my friends claim that I am a strict boomer. lol.. this is because they say I call out my friends and nephews. I guess I am. As "respect" is a part of it, it's more like "manners" for me. I can remember my mom telling me when I was a kid, "Even if we don't have money, I can teach you manners because that reflects who you are and not the people around you." It took me a while to understand that, but as I grew older I started to understand that whatever you do reflects you. Regardless of the status, of how people treat you, age, whether they respect me or not, look down upon me or deem me praiseworthy. I treat them as how I would like to be treated even if that is not reciprocated. Because that says a lot about me, how I was raised, and not about them. You treat everyone politely because you are a polite person. Regardless of culture. So I understand where they are coming from, but that is only from my perspective. :)

Hana
>>99997818

"Even if we don't have money, I can teach you manners because that reflects who you are and not the people around you." Let's hug, that reminds me of my grandfather ;-;

Melanie Lillis
>>99997818

Always totally understood where they were coming from!! 100000%. I was more referencing the fact that someone is automatically given more respect than you depending on specific factors. But yes love the values you were instilled with 😍

Hana
>>99981811

You know this is funny. Because just like in Korean, my language too has these different levels honorifics for someone in the same age range, someone who is much older, and someone who is much experienced. But honestly I get so confused (i'm trilingual and i'm bad at all 3 languages so i have an excuse) that I use the utmost level of respect when speaking to people who is at least a year ahead of me in terms of experience or older at least 2 years older than me. I keep getting laughed at because of that 😂