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Side Quest, Episode 49: Diablo Immortal and Building A Better Games Industry (Patreon)

Published:
2018-11-05 18:08:23
Edited:
2019-01-08 23:25:48
Imported:
2022-01

Content


Files

Diablo Immortal and Building a Better Games Industry -- CLS Side Quest

At BlizzCon 2018, Blizzard announced a new Diablo game, and it wasn't at all what the series' core fanbase wanted or expected. But here's the thing: The reaction to the announcement isn't only predictable, but completely counterproductive. As the gulf between developers, gamers, and the media grows ever-wider, can we use Diablo Immortal and the drama surrounding it as something to learn from, instead of yet another thing to be furious over? Colin's Last Stand: Side Quest is free of baked-in ads, product placement, and other obnoxious forms of advertising because of your support. Please consider subscribing to CLS' Patreon to show your support for independent content: http://www.patreon.com/colinslaststand Listen to Sacred Symbols, CLS' PlayStation podcast (also available on podcast services and here on YouTube): http://soundcloud.com/sacredsymbols Listen to the CLS interview podcast, Colin’s Last Stand: Fireside Chats (also available on podcast services): https://soundcloud.com/colinslaststand Listen to the CLS retro podcast, Colin’s Last Stand: KnockBack (also available on podcast services): http://soundcloud.com/clsknockback Twitter: @notaxation Instagram: @clsmoriarty Facebook: /colinslaststand Colin's Last Stand is a product of Colin's Last Stand, LLC PO Box 1233 | Santa Monica, CA 90406 The following stories were cited in this video: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/08/blizzard-confirms-multiple-diablo-projects-in-production-news-by-end-of-2018/ https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-11-03-diablo-immortal-is-surprisingly-good-what-little-consolation-that-may-be https://www.ign.com/articles/2011/10/22/the-playstation-vita-is-set-to-succeed https://mashable.com/article/diablo-immortal-blowback-entitled-gamers/#aLdTGnIMoPqp https://kotaku.com/blizzard-says-it-wasnt-expecting-fans-to-be-this-angry-1830204721 https://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2015/08/05/believe-it-or-not-diablo-3-is-now-the-10th-best-selling-video-game-of-all-time/#6e5b57772ab4 The videos below were used, in part, in the creation of this episode of Side Quest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2XrDEl9wuE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xp20voR11gs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtSmAwpVHsA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ab2-WW1skOM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKgAbOqhJOE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9mUe5vHYzs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkPVbi2i04Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZoaec37uaI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooyjaVdt-jA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enBDsP5XXXA Still imagery used in this video was garnered from the following sources: Activision, Amazon, Gamepur, Giant Bomb, Mighty No. 9, and MIT Sloan Entertainment, and Nintendo. Additional images were acquired from a licensed Shutterstock account via the following photographers and artists: boonchoke, Casimiro PT, Dean Drobot, Farik Gallery, FGC, James Steidl, Konontsev Artem, MY Stock, rawpixel.com, Siberian Art, Stephen Rees, and Zenzen.

Comments

Brock Smith

Oh look 👀, logic. It’s been a while since I’ve seen some here on the ole’ interwebz.

Kyle Goodrich

I was wondering if you'd do a video on this, gonna watch it now!

John Nelson

I think your intentions are good, but it ultimately looks like more talking down. Toxic discourse isn't a function of real life. It's a function of social media. And it especially isn't an implied function of your audience. Those who sway towards the middle can deal the most destruction.

tejotl

Well the only element of this outrage that I do get is how out of touch activision blizzard is to have that announcement as the final big thing during a fan-fest. It just makes you think but I absolutely agree that things just get blown out of proportions both in terms of negative/rage and positive/hype

Brent Lindquist

As if trying to help prove your point, the "Up next" video that played after this one on YouTube was titled "How Diablo Immortal Killed Diablo." Good lord.

Adam Niksch

I enjoyed diablo 3, and honestly with the way this game was teased, I think a number of us were expecting a diablo 2 (or 1) remaster. But my friends and I just watched, to see if they could sell this idea to us. They didn’t, and we won’t be purchasing the game. That kinda seems like it’s as far as it should go from our end. Constructive feedback to the devs is helpful, but what we saw during the Q&A was hardly that (there were a few exceptions). But honestly, how could Blizzard not see this coming? This convention is for their most hardcore fans. They don’t play games on phones, they play PC games. BlizzCon just didn’t really seem like the place to announce this at all, especially given its placement on the BlizzCon schedule, relative to their other more hardcore offerings. It still doesn’t excuse the harassment, but quite frankly the Blizzard of old would have known how this would have played out.

Toren R. (KESA)

I super don't care about Diablo having never played it, but I feel like a lot of the anger about it being a mobile game has to do it the medium by and large struggling to make deep, robust, games that allow for player to get really, really meticulous with how they play it. Instead, much of the mobile game market is defined by swiping and tapping, which is all good and great, but it seems pretty antithetical to the very spirit of Diablo. Also, mobile games have a perception of being built solely to be monetized without shame, and the game industry has no one but themselves to blame for that perception. So I can see why an audience of paying fans, who love the depth that the PC game brings, being a bit pissed about how this was announced especially with not so much as even a nod to D4. Blizzard are supposed to be the ones that GET them, right? this just seems so tone deaf. Then you have everyone on twitter with a checkmark grandstanding about misogyny and toxicity and whatever else. Not for anything, but you're allowed to not like something and you're allowed to say it. and if a lot of people feel similarly, it doesn't mean that you're an asshole for not liking something, and I think the years of games media taking every opportunity to self aggrandize by throwing shade at their readership just has everyone tired. again, I dont care about diablo one bit, but as someone who hates The Last Jedi, I have a pretty recent memory of being labeled (at least tangentially) with being racist for thinking the movie was awful by a media that seems much more interested in keeping a good relationship with the industry it covers than it does covering it honestly. I see a lot of that same spirit here - not with your video - but with the 120 character think pieces on twitter by people who get access to the game makers and their products for free and early, which seems to be a bit hard to take seriously if you ask me. If you're going to ask me to care enough to spend hundreds of dollars and hours on a product, then you also are asking me to care enough to speak up when I don't agree with the direction something is going. People aren't assholes for doing that, even in mass. Mobile games aren't often deep but are typically made to milk every cent they can, and if this game is different, great, but it's on Blizzard to explain that to an audience it should know by now...not by deleting comments for merely expressing dissent. so while I dont care about diablo, or this new mobile game, i just come away hating most of games media even more for predictably brow beating it's readership yet again. but again, I liked your video. I like you. you're crushing shit.

Lockmort

Thank god for you. I hope this video will blow up, you're one of the only people in the industry using rational thought and remaining calm and professional. The question the fan in the audience asked was docile and snarky, nothing else. The way games media reacted to it, was incredibly dumb, one sided, and only fueled the fire even more, which made everyone react even more volatile (which is also ridiculous). I wish everyone would just calm down, especially the outlets who, once again, brand their entire audience as "toxic manbabies", which makes them act like... toxic manbabies. I genuinely miss the early 2000's when none of this nonsense was happening and I could just read about games, which is ultimately a hobby. Thank you for all your hard work, there should be more of you.

Owen

The weirdest thing was where I heard that Blizzard deleted and reuploaded videos to deflate the dislike numbers. Like that shit isn't ok. -- That said people ragging on those devs while they're on stage need to get a fucking life. No one deserves that, those dudes were just doing the job they were told to do. Shit storm all around.

Joey Finelli

I am mad because i don't know who I am supposed to be mad at.

LastStandMedia
>>16904509

I actually was gonna take a week off for Side Quest this week, but I couldn't help myself. So I'll take next week off, instead.

LastStandMedia
>>16904528

I don't agree that I'm talking down to anyone. Quite the contrary, I'm telling angry people to speak the only language that matters.

Hose A Contra Razz

Well said, I am like right in the middle. You explained everything with neutral and exactly fair. God job

LastStandMedia
>>16904630

Maybe it's because I personally know so many people who work in games on the PR, marketing, etc. side, and while they fuck up all the time (like we all do), I remain confused why people don't understand that they never mean to disappoint anyone, and maybe it's through that lens that we should examine things.

LastStandMedia
>>16904854

I felt bad for the dev on stage, myself. I guarantee you that these guys didn't ask to make a mobile game. And if they did, well, they're still dumping their all into it.

LastStandMedia
>>16904933

They did that? I didn't even notice. I think I grabbed the thumbs up/down images on Saturday.

Anonymous

Bethesda got it right at E3. Elder Scrolls mobile game would have gotten the same reaction as Diablo Immortal had they not also teased Elder Scrolls 6.

hugplx

I've long ago stopped following the internet's reaction to outrage. I'm sure many who are acting outraged maybe played Diablo 3 over a weekend seven years ago and have no idea why everyone is truly angry. I seriously sympathise with the die hards at Blizzcon though. Some flew across the planet because they were teased a 'big Diablo announcement' (many suspected Diablo 2 remastered) and spent thousands of dollars to be there. You're not doing to convince me that no one at Blizzard didn't say 'this is a fucking mistake.' Doubly so given the Auction House fiasco at Diablo 3's launch, and how hard they had to work to reearn the players' trust. Ultimately, as you say, the game's existence is whatever. I legitimately think no one would care if they had a proper Diablo announcement to go along with it. There's no way Blizzard didn't know that, they're not stupid. I play a lot of Diablo. I know I felt like I wasted my money on the virtual ticket to this year's blizzcon. I'm content with just not playing Immortal and waiting for the real game, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I felt tricked into getting that $80 ticket. I can't imagine how I'd feel if I'd flown over from Australia and paid thousands of dollars to go...

Anonymous

Honestly the video could have been a clip from the Blizzcon, screen shots of the outrage, screen shots of journos response then cut to Colin sitting with Lola in his lap then him saying “be nice to each other, yada, yada, yada. I’ve made this same video multiple times this year so “f” it you know what I’m saying right Lola?” Cut to Lola yawning and going to sleep

Anonymous

What I’m trying to say is more Lola

David Kramme

Definitely Lola FTW, I love Diablo 3 and I'll still be loving it after Immortal is released, this outrage is understandable but also totally pointless in the end, looking forward to the video, thanks Colin.

Kenneth Oms

Great comments as always Colin. Couldn't agree more. One thing is, a few redditors have put together a time line that shows that two weeks before the event the Community Manager had come in and asked people to temper their expectations last minute. It seems they were going to tease a bigger Diablo but changed their minds last minute after months of hype, not saying toxicity is warranted but I can understand the "bait-and-switch" feeling. I think the most interesting part is that people said they should have done what Bethesda did. introduced a mobile game and then a short teaser confirming the bigger games which is something that you found puzzling by Bethesda. Do you think they should have gone that route?

LastStandMedia
>>16905359

The marketing could have been better, but it's ultimately a choice to attend BlizzCon (and there's a lot more to it than merely sitting at a press conference), and Immortal's existence in no way means Diablo IV isn't going to be a thing. In fact, the word is that they outsourced the game, meaning that virtually no internal Blizzard resources of note are being use on Immortal. That should be good news, no?

LastStandMedia
>>16906076

They may have had something to say and then realized it wasn't the right time. That happens at E3 all the time, sometimes very last minute (oh the stories I could tell!). I think they should have announced the game, made no reference to tangible future Diablo projects, and just said, "we have a lot of Diablo in the pipeline, including something for all of the hardcore fans out there." Easy enough.

Jason Pettet

I will say as a fan of Diablo for some 20 years this announcement infuriated me at first. I was more frustrated at Blizz for being so blind to their audience than anything. Then I got more frustrated with how people in media and other internet groups were defending it and calling me an idiot for being frustrated about it. So having seen the cycle for the past few days first hand this video has helped me snap out of it and I just wanted to say thank you Colin.

Joey Rawlings

It's funny to think that something this large was completely missed by me and I wasn't aware of it until this video. I'm no PC gamer, nor am I a mobile gamer, but I find it fascinating that my 'gaming circle' totally missed this. I guess it goes to show I don't visit gaming websites often and my sources for news and such are limited only to a select few people and their content.

John Quinn

I feel like all this could have been avoided if they just decided to announce this at Apple’s event or something like that. I think that’s what Bethesda did with the elder scrolls mobile game.

Ryan R. Kittredge

Great video. I’ve been a long time fan of diablo. Played all three for more hours than I can count. While I am a bit disappointed that this won’t be a full PC release, the outage this is getting is beyond ridiculous. Just seems like as much as nerd/gamer culture is becoming more accepted, nerds/gamers are trying as hard as possible to drive it backwards.

Zack E

This type of stuff is so silly. Do you think this is the sort of reaction that Bethesda was worried about, and therefore put themselves in different hole with announcing a game that might be 7 (or more) years away? I just can’t fathom the overall entitlement that gaming communities have in regards to the games series that they play. It’s so strange. It’s like they forget that actual human beings make these products. Criticize products all you want, but doing weird mean-spirited things (without even actually being hands on with a final release) is just unnecessary. I just find the Q&A session, regardless of how “hardcore” fans these were, to be entirely disrespectful towards the developers. This event partly exists for the fans, but why should Blizzard do it if they get treated like that. For what it’s worth, a mobile Diablo game, if done right of course, actually sounds rather intriguing.

Justin Marxer

Viva la outrage culture. Sure, it sucks that this game will be on mobile rather than console or PC, but you know what also sucks? Not having medical insurance, clean running water, a roof over your head, etc. There are better, more pertinent topics to be outraged about.

Cory Hahn

I've been a huge fan of the Diablo franchise and have played Diablo 2 and Diablo 3 extensively over the years on both PC and console. When I heard about Diablo Immortal coming out as a mobile game, I was genuinely excited. When I followed the story more and saw the outrage from others, I felt bad for those presenting it and for the individuals who were in a frenzy over the news. As you've said numerous times over the years, "vote with your wallet." If this isn't what the fans wanted for the Diablo franchise, then those people need to not play it rather than spout contempt and hatred. I know I'm in the minority on this one, but I am looking forward to this game. As a working adult, I find that good mobile games are perfect for squeezing in 3-5 minutes of fun throughout the day until I can commute home and turn on the PS4. Thus, depending on the design and implementation of the core Diablo experience, I can see myself enjoying the game in short bursts while I'm on a short break or waiting for the train.

Dennis Meinschein

I'll have to admit I wasn't impressed with the thought of a Diablo Mobile game at first. I dont play Mobile games. They are fun for about an hour or so then they usually end up bogged down by time or in game purchases. On the other hand this is ....Blizzard. They have repeatedly given their games so much loving attention that a lot of other game studios and developers would do well to follow that philosophy. There's no doubt in my mind that Diablo Immortals will be a damn good Mobile game.

Craig Carter

Dropping truth bombs my dude. This video was fucking great Colin, well done!

Peter Campbell

Enjoyed the video, even though I look at the situation and wonder WTF, who cares about a mobile game. Shows how insane things are.

strawhatninja

This reminds me of what Square said about the future of the Final Fantasy games. They want a platform rather then a game which I'm always scared to hear.

Dan Parsons

I love almost everything about your content Colin, with the tiny exception of when you say “,well” in scripted pieces. Another great piece here though.

Marc Boggio

Bethesda did the “we have a mobile game based on this beloved franchise” best during the Fallout 4 reveal. Fallout 4 was announced and heavily demonstrated and then they said “we also have a mobile game that is deep and fun, free to play and you can download it right now”. Had they held off on announcing Diablo Immortal until they had it ready to go (as in “you can download it right now” ready to go) and announced it on the tail end of a solid Diablo 4 announcement, this would be talked about in a TOTALLY different light.

Matthew Perry

The moral of the story is ...stop making mobile games , they suck ;-) but in no way should this story of gone viral ?!?! People can be passionate about games , I get it but seriously where do we draw the line ?

Matthew Clarkson

Can I say I didn’t even know this was a thing. Not a huge fan of the series or mobile games but I mite check this one out.

Anonymous

Awesome video. As a fan of Blizzard and Diablo I would have rather have seen Diablo 4 announced with Blizzard's trademark "Soon" label, but I'm not that angry. I think the better strategy would be to announce it at PAX East like they did with Hearthstone.

Ian (616Entertainment)

The fucking sarcasm in this one made my day. The whole thing has been ridiculous. I'm a Diablo fan, I love Diablo III. I saw this announcement and my genuine reaction was "oh, a mobile game? Fuck that," and I moved on. I don't hate anybody working on it. I get it. Its money. Games media shitting on their readers is nothing new, and the best part is you are LITERALLY the only person on the internet who talks about it. Everyone pretends they have no idea what that even means. I saw some moron on Twitter today try and say that mobile gaming only started to get labeled as "not real gaming" after it was discovered that a strong percentage of mobile gamers are women. The media and gamers bury it to try and bury women, I guess. What does that even mean? The whole world of games is a sewer sometimes, Colin. I'm glad to back the dude who's tryna clean out the fuckin pipes. Have a good night.

That black guy

Disagree on activison's influence over the announcement, mainly because just like the safety of call of duty, Activision likes to port/have another a version made for everything. Like there is a call of duty mobile game but there also was an announced and released console/ pc game, similar to how they use to do marvel games on every system even if only the core plot and one or two set pieces were similar but made from the ground up for that system (the Spider-Man games which sometimes had gba/ds and psp versions as well as console versions). Even Skylanderd has a version on EVERYTHING feasible. So the ideas activison controlled this announcement doesn't ring true to their Portfolio which is saturation on every system possible, especially the "you don't have a phone" . It seems much more the blizzard part (as it was a merger not a buyout) losing the plot, which there been hints of that since the original world of warcraft where both star craft 2 and Diablo 3 went to the clear Blackburner of the company much like how overwatch has seemingly made Diablo 4/warcraft 4/starcraft 3 a low priority. Also from software and Activision have a relationship based on the original ps1 tenchu games. To say they jumped in for sekiro because it is highly profitable from software ignores the relationship they previously had and may be rebuilding.

That black guy

Also a bigger problem comes from the fact, in people researching Diablo immortal and the dev, it turns out the devs of the title made an identical title down to the UI, 2 years ago called crusader of light. So this isn't just a normal "built from the ground up" Diablo game just for mobile, it's a reskin of an existing title just now with Diablo items and classes. Edit: and after diving deeper the issue is more notable as because crusader of light IS on the Pc already on steam, so the blizzard team asking "what do you not have a phone" stands out as weirder

Anonymous

Great video, really explained the issue well and provided solutions to a serious problem between fans, developers, and the media.

Chris B

While I was disappointed in the announcement, I didn’t understand the outright rage. Did people forget this is the same company that made hearthstone, a game that is huge on mobile. Of course blizzard would try to emulate that success with another ip.

That black guy
>>16932675

Except and this is a big thing, Hearthstone is also on pc and in fact was pc first(March 11th 2014 with ios launching April 16th and Android last at December 15th) edit: and the pc player base is notably sized. This has no pc plans, when asked the developer said "what don't you have a phone" ... Also this is a reskin of an existing game by the same developer (crusader of light)

Chris B
>>16932675

I was confused by the only on phones part, and the “phones” comment may be the worst thing on a stage since Jamie Kennedy at e3. Maybe I’m just jaded from being disappointed by blizzard since 2012. Yes I’m that guy that was let down by the simplification of d3, but I also didn’t rage against the devs.

That black guy
>>16932675

Chris and I understand that you were disappointed by that you have all right to bem but imagine putting in for time off for Blizzcon, booking a flight and hotel or simply throwing down 50 dollars for the virtual ticket after hearing about the bigger Diablo presence this year. Arriving/tuning in and seeing that beautiful cg trailer... Just to be told "it's a mobile game and we have 0 plans to port it to pc" and there being 0 reassurances UNTIL AFTER that "yes Diablo 4 is coming but we weren't ready to talk about it". I'm not saying "it's okay they went nuts" but I can understand why they're angry about it, some irrationally so as not everyone is stable

Chris B
>>16932675

I wasn’t thinking about the price of admission/travel some would have invested into this. Good point.

LastStandMedia
>>16906431

Glad to help snap you out of it. The only way we can break these cycles is to be cognizant of when we ourselves are getting sucked into the fray.

LastStandMedia
>>16907374

I think everything will calm down for good when Diablo IV is finally revealed. Sounds like they were planning something, but who knows...

LastStandMedia
>>16908120

That's almost certainly what they were trying to avoid (when it comes to Bethesda). We touch on that a bit in this week's Sacred Symbols, if you've not yet heard it.

LastStandMedia
>>16908615

I think there are far more people excited about it than would care to admit, considering the climate. I think you should enjoy what you should enjoy, and my sneaking suspicion is that Activision and Blizzard are going to be most pleased with the monies made on the project.

LastStandMedia
>>16909244

I think people are likely a little more concerned about how it will be monetized, etc. The stupid thing to worry about for these folks, though, is the opportunity cost, of which there is none. There are thousands of people working at Blizzard, and the next main Diablo game is in development, beyond a shadow of a doubt. People need to relax!

LastStandMedia
>>16911689

Well considering the more recent news about Final Fantasy, it seems we have a lot to be scared about when it comes to that franchise. LOL.

LastStandMedia
>>16918082

There are a million different ways, in reality, they could have handled the situation better. But alas...

LastStandMedia
>>16921967

As I said in the video, and as you know, mobile gaming started getting a bad reputation when its poor business practices migrated to the console, handheld, and PC spaces. And that's basically the long and short of it. The PlayStation Store is an abomination now because Sony is trying to mimic what was done elsewhere.

LastStandMedia
>>16928643

You're a little off on your interpretation. From Software owns the rights to Tenchu, but they didn't make any of the games (save one). Sony owned the rights to Tenchu; it was developed by Acquire (they most recently helped with Octopath). Activision acquired the rights to Tenchu, and then flipped them to From Software a little more then a decade ago. So I don't think their relationship with From over Sekiro has anything to do with Tenchu, as they never actually worked together on the franchise. (The last Tenchu game was published by Ubisoft.)

LastStandMedia
>>16932675

Yeah, as I said in the video, Hearthstone is huge BECAUSE of mobile, though Hearthstone isn't a real Warcraft game...

That black guy
>>16928643

After some research we're both off. Activison published the first 4 games in America, Sony Japan owned rights and published in japan for the first 2 and then handed them off seemingly to From software as From came in as publisher on the side of the Japanese market for 3/wrath of heaven and its super turbo-esqe re-release return from darkness while K2 (a subsidiary of Capcom funny enough) worked as the developer for both games (and continued to work as developer until tenchu Z with From &amp; Sega as publisher except for Z where Microsoft worked with from) finally ending with the one you're talking about published by ubisoft and again published by . Also it came out in an interview Sekiro did start off as a tenchu title in some way shape or form and evolved from there, so while I can't confirm the original thing I said (their previous working relationship being the lynch pin) I wasn't just fully stabbing in the dark. Here's the interview <a href="https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-08-24-when-from-software-knocks-on-your-door-and-says-hey-we-wanna-make-a-game-you-have-only-one-answer-right" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-08-24-when-from-software-knocks-on-your-door-and-says-hey-we-wanna-make-a-game-you-have-only-one-answer-right</a>

Always86

I wonder if they are saying mobile only because you can get away with Freemium on mobile where as gamers are rebelling against loot boxes on real platforms.

LastStandMedia
>>16998803

Possibly, though some games do extraordinarily well on console with microtransactions, like FIFA.