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Star Trek: TNG 3x05 Full Reaction! (Patreon)

Published:
2024-09-28 17:00:06
Imported:
2024-11
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Star Trek TNG 3×05 Full Reaction

Download Full Reaction (3.6 GB) Full Reaction You are now able to stream the full reaction directly from this website. Alternatively, you can download it to your computer using

Comments

Ryan

Before watching the reaction, I just have to note that it's convenient we have this episode about dealing with loss, right when we all need it after losing the legendary, the incomparable Maggie Smith. And suddenly I wish I hadn't used up so many superlatives with James Earl Jones because it's really hard to not just repeat myself. While thinking back over her career in the last 24 hours, what really struck me is that she was the very rare actor whose career arc was just a constant upward slope, with every new year being the biggest she'd ever been. Multiple generations have their own iconic beloved role from her, like Jean Brodie, Diana Barrie, Wendy Darling (that's mine), Professor McGonagall, and Dowager Countess Grantham. I also learned she was only a Grammy away from being an EGOT, and she absolutely could have put out a diss album that would get one if she'd wanted. There are so many stories of her being exactly the kind of person in real life that you'd hope for, witty, erudite, and shockingly humble. It's not often that someone who lived such a long, rich life hits this hard when they go.

Saltire
>>150767683

Yeah Maggie I thought would live forever, she had such a formidable spirit. One of the finest actors of all time, who started off in theatre running rings around the great Lawrence Olivier before moving into film and tv, like Hopkins did. She however always preferred the theatre and like Alec Guinness with Star Wars, saw Harry Potter as her pension along with her success on Downton Abbey (which I've never watched as I have an aversion to the "upper class"). The Lady In The Van was also a fairly recent triumph for her which is a fantastic film as well. Oh and her wonderful hamming it up in the Agatha Christie stuff and the hilarious Murder By Death (also with the aforementioned Guinness) and Prime Of Miss Jean Brodie for which she got her first Oscar, for which she didn't even bother turning up for as it clashed with a theatrical performance. That was Maggie. RIP.

Ryan

I winced hard at your description of your mental state going into this, thinking "Well, this one isn't going to help much." But at least it's a true quality work that stands as the career birth of a writer you adore, Ronald D. Moore. If there's ever a biopic of Moore, this part will probably be laughed off the screen as people assume it's just Hollywood bullshit, but we have numerous eyewitness accounts that it really did happen this way. During Season 2 he was on a tour of the set when he mentioned to a crew member that he'd written basically a fanfic script for the show. He actually got the right people to take a look, and despite this not being at all the way writers are supposed to offer themselves, the sheer quality of his work got it all the way up the chain until Roddenberry himself saw it...and promptly played the part of the fuddy duddy old guard who refuse to recognize a new young genius, saying that in his vision of the future humanity had completely evolved past the concept of grief, and probably told him to focus more on I'm In Love With My Car. But with Season 3 getting a new show runner, there was now enough distance from Roddenberry that they were willing to give it another shot, and the rest is history. Or as you might say, all of this has happened before and will happen again. The best part of all of Moore's Trek scripts is how clearly you can spot the seeds of what he'd do with Battlestar (and For All Mankind these days). The episode starts off with a totally standard Trek setup, an away team searching some mysterious site, before some booby trap is activated and a Red Shirt is killed to show how serious the situation is. Except this time, that death is considered important enough to be used as the big dramatic moment to lead into the credits (and aided by some exceptionally believable and painful-looking makeup rather than something like being turned into a dodecahedron). And as the first act goes on, you realize Moore isn't kidding around with this, and the entire episode really is "What if a Red Shirt died, and people actually cared?" This was a human being with her own life, and loved ones who are now grieving, plus Worf's guilt at failing to protect her and Wesley's bad memories being stirred up. I'd even go so far as to say the alien twist was a mistake and this emotional story easily could have carried the whole episode, and I wonder if Moore put it in preemptively before he could start his career with a reputation as a troublemaker who wouldn't play by the rules. And even better? You have plenty more Ron Moore scripts to look forward to on this show and Deep Space Nine if you decide to do it (he left the franchise during Voyager, feeling that no one else on the crew had his same passion anymore; supposedly the breaking point was when he asked a more experienced writer on the show how B'Elanna would respond to a certain situation, and was told "No one cares, do whatever you want"). And they're all at this same level.

Thomas Corp

Sorry to hear, Jess, that you were having a bad day with the anxiety and OCD, though that is nice to see you still dance to the theme. Likewise, that is quite the compliment you imparted to us how we exhibit such warmth whilst sharing this show with you. I’m sorry to say that I’ll be somewhat fucking useless in that regard this week. Or, well, the warmth is still there, just soaked in the river of tears from this episode. You mentioned how you were a bit more sensitive to the emotional aspects of the episode. That was me as well as this one hit home, HARD. One thing for sure, I’m goddamn fucking relieved beyond belief that we didn’t have this episode next weekend; it could have been a LOT WORSE if it was. And like you said, not exactly the ideal episode to watch whilst struggling, yet it results in a shared struggle, which as you noted, we are going through it and getting through it together. I hear you on the catharsis. I’ve said how Star Trek shows are ones where I rank favorite episodes by character. This one is up there high in terms of best ensemble episodes as everyone shines so goddamn brightly in this one. The whole focus on grief in this is strikingly good. Yes, the heart goes out to Jeremy. It’s funny, for someone who says that he doesn’t deal well with kids, Picard stepped up to the plate. He has my thing with kids of you talk to them like grownups, which in this case, is most helpful. Lovely moment where Riker admits it’s a feeling that you hope you never get used to. And Jonathan and Brent sell the scene of Riker and Data having the great moment of reminiscing about Tasha. And it leads to Data’s query of why that loss felt stronger for him, and Riker concedes that he has no answer, and that he wishes he did. Loved your comments on that. Michael, likewise, sells Worf’s despair of not being able to avenge his fallen comrade’s death and the desire to offer the bonding experience with Jeremy. Loved how Deanna got him to talk to her. And it brings us to a big great thing of the episode: the highlighting the importance of Deanna. First seeing this show, Deanna quickly came in at third favorite of the main crew behind Picard and Beverly. As I get older, I find those feelings increase for the very reasons you so eloquently spoke of. I adored your statements on loving how Marina got the fantastic showing as Deanna in this episode, and the respect for how difficult a job she would have in helping others with grief, especially for a young boy. I like how we shared the uncertainty of the being that took the form of Jeremy’s mom. We have, after all, seen way too much sci-fi. Appreciate the response you had to the bribery with the cat, because THAT’S LOW. And yes, of course Patches is adorable. In this scenario, it is really nice how the being is not a villain, and even calling the being an antagonist feels a stretch. Love how you loved Geordi pulling through, showing how the being was unprepared for the power of Geordi. And he’s about the only one who didn’t make you cry, which is a plus. The hardest scene for me was the Beverly and Wesley scene where they talk about Jack. Both Gates and Wil were wonderful, and it reminds us that there is a reason why Wil still views Gates as his mom, and even still calls her “Space Mom”. You and I, Jess, had the strong tears shared on that scene. The worst part for me was where Wesley mentioned about forgetting his father’s face, and Beverly saying there are times she can’t forget it. That part was VISCERALLY relatable. The difference, in my case, is that it is the voice rather than the face. You find there’s occasions where you start to forget what the voice sounded like, and like Beverly says, some days you can’t get it out of your head. Fuck, that scene got me bad. Another part that got me bad was Deanna speaks of how “Children often feel they must be true to the memory of a lost parent. If you offer affection too soon, they can feel guilty returning that affection, as if they’re betraying the love of the parent.” I paused to cry, whilst nodding and whispering, “That’s very true.” All culminating in the big scene Wesley has, which I take your point how you wish he didn’t have the prompting, yet you also note my thoughts on how they balance that out at the end of sometimes people do need the push. God, does it get you seeing Wil sell how Wesley finally gets off his chest his feelings of what happened. Loved Patrick providing the moment of Picard having the one small gasp before encouraging Wesley to continue. It then allows Jeremy to finally express his own pain, and leads to the ceremony, your reactions to all of it being perfect, Jess. Such appreciation how Wesley says how no one can ever prepare you for the pain. It is true. Even if one is an adult, like was said in The Golden Girls, “When you lose a parent, you might as well be six.” This was a very emotional episode and reaction to share with you, Jess. It was greatly appreciated, thank you.

Thomas Corp
>>150767683

Yeah, I wanted to write something about Maggie on one of the Classic Who uploads. One thing that stopped that was, far as I can recall, Maggie is one of the few titans of English stage and screen that never appeared on Doctor Who. She is in that same league of excellence as James Earl Jones. It says something when even the great Alan Rickman said she could thoroughly intimidate you just with a raise of her eyebrow. Multiple iconic roles. McGonagall probably being one of the most, if not the most prominent for the Millennial crowd. First saw her in Hook and The Secret Garden, which my mom especially adores her in the latter film. My dad quite liked her in Sister Act, and he loved her big, “I assure you that she is no broad.” scene at the end of that. There’s a soft spot for her one guest appearance on Carol Burnett when she has the parent teacher conference with Eunice, Ed, and Mama. I see Murder By Death has been mentioned, and she, and everyone in that is excellent. They’re actually going to have that on TCM as part of a tribute to Capote on what would have been his one hundredth birthday, but it ends up being nicely timed to pay tribute to Maggie. If you’ve ever seen The VIPs, she has an excellent scene with Richard Burton in that. Saw the film eight years ago, loved the film, and that scene stood out as being perhaps my favorite scene of the film. Shame she never did the hypothetical diss album because I would pay cash money for that one.

Ryan
>>150774470

Wil had already done Stand By Me, and I imagine he was drawing back to that for these scenes. It unfortunately couldn't be for his real parents, who he's always had an incredibly troubled relationship with. And it certainly helps getting to say the lines of a genius like Ron Moore who always knows how to cut through all the sci-fi jargon and get to the human emotional core.

Thomas Corp
>>150774470

Wil in Stand By Me is so good. I know of his frankly, from the sound of what I’ve read, disastrous home life he had with his parents. Which is one of the shining things about his experience of Next Gen, despite all the shit that the fans gave Wesley. That as fate would have it, the whole cast just adopted him, and he turned out awesome. And I love his relationship with Gates especially that as I said, he still affectionately calls her “Space Mom”.

Thomas Corp
>>150772323

Yeah, the heart did sink a bit hearing Jess say she was struggling. Though, like she said herself, and I somewhat anticipated her response, the catharsis and distraction was genuinely helpful. And if nothing else, there was a strong shared cry with this one. I have read how Moore had the unconventional method of how he got this script noticed. With that, the resistance faced from Roddenberry who was firmly adamant that in the twenty-fourth century, we would be past grief, and that people would express the bullshit that, “Death is a natural part of life. Rejoice for those around you who transform into the Force. Mourn them do not. Miss them do not.” and he had the insistence of sticking to keeping Star Trek filled with the scantily clad women with episodes that the teenagers can crank the stereo up and bang their heads to. The world is forever grateful that Moore got the chance, and nicely done with the Battlestar reference. The whole thing of the redshirt dies, and people actually care, and it gets treated as a very devastating thing, it’s all done so well. Whilst I don’t mind the alien twist, I do see your point how this emotional story easily could have carried the whole episode. Probably was a preemptive strike done by Moore. I recall that Jess has said she has a strong recollection of both Deep Space Nine and Voyager, though I would be most agreeable to sharing rewatches with her. If that’s something she wants to do, that is.

Dave Hampton

I am sorry were having a tough time when you filmed this. I know you are usually ahead in filming so hopefully you are doing better now. Knowing this episode and hearing your opening I knew how much episode this was going to get to you emotionally. I figured it would on any given day but even more so after the opening comments. As far as the episode goes when I was younger, I thought this was an OK episode, but it was not a great one to me. Now my opinion has changed, and I do think it is a great episode. I tried to figure out why my opinion has changed. I think the best reason I can see is that when I was younger, I was watching it as a Sci Fi show and the Sci FI element of this episode is ok but not great. The non sci fi aspects of this episode is where it shines, and I am able to appreciate them more and see what a well written episode this is.

Geordie Joe

I hope this emotional episode helped in some way to ease your anxiety. I've rewatched this episode countless times over the years and it never fails to make a tear roll down my cheek at some point. There were a few extra tears today while watching your reaction I must admit. This was Ronald D. Moore's first script as a writer for TNG. Keep an eye out for his name showing up in the opening credits going forward because every TNG episode that man was involved with is amazing. "On the starship Enterprise, no one is alone." One of my favourite Picard quotes. I loved seeing how invested you were in this story and the characters. Trying to reassure Jeremy when Worf grabbed him from the transporter pad. Little moments like that are one of the reasons why you're my favourite reactor.

Josef Schiltz

Having to cope with anxiety has been the bane of my life also, Jess. We hope that continuing to be a support is a help. Remembering those earliest days with Who, and you sitting there agog with the first Christopher Eccleston and exclaiming, "WHAT am I looking at?" That was a treasured moment. Sharing your memories of watching Star Trek with your dad was another. I cried with you when, first Nicholas Courtney, then our dear Pat came on the scene in The Five Doctors. I felt that. This time round, as the Doctor, Pat forgot about his curlers, so his hair is as flat as a pancake, rather than the unruly mop that he had as the Doctor in his own era. One of my illustration tutors at college, the artist and author, the late James Broom Lynne, was a personal friend of Pat. I could see that by my tutor's character that those two would be swopping bawdy stories in a pub somewhere. Maybe they still are! I can just hear Pat saying, "Come along, James - or Jimmy? - The sun is above the yard arm. Let's go and have a pint!" I had a feeling that this episode of TNG would get to you. There are some crackers and some treasured moments to come. Make it so. As the much adored Tom Baker would say, "Happy Times and Places!"

Tsuliwaensis

what an episode to watch when you've already had a day... but sometimes, there's nothing better than having a good cry, flooding out all the stress hormones and getting a little emotional reset. I sure hope it helped. and it's always good to know where to find episodes like this, when you need them.