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Typical Tuesday Suggestions - 06/28/2022 - ANTI BLOAT EDITION (Patreon)

Published:
2022-06-28 21:43:15
Imported:
2022-08

Content

Hey folks! I have a very important mission for you all.

By now I will just assume every single one of you played with our mods. I mean, why would you donate to us if you didn't enjoy our mods.

I admit, some of our mods, especially the older ones, might suffer from an old genetic disease called Bloatoris Maxima - meaning they might have *some* bloat in them.

Now,  you probably wonder what bloat is. Everyone has a different definition, but generally, bloat can be defined as:

Bloat (bhel, Proto-Indo-European root meaning "to blow, swell," "with derivatives referring to various round objects and to the notion of tumescent masculinity" Bloat, meaning "puffed up, swollen." It is perhaps from a Scandinavian source akin to Old Norse blautr "soaked, soft from being cooked in liquid" (compare Swedish blöt fisk "soaked fish"), possibly from Proto-Germanic *blaut-, from PIE *bhleu- "to swell, well up," extended form of root bhel "to blow, swell.")

As such, I define bloat as 'content for the sake of content, without specific purpose or niche'. 

Now, I know that many of you like content for the sake of content - I mean, I do too. I love a diverse rimworld world, with many different guns with barely any changes to stats. It adds to storytelling.

However

At some point in the future I'd like to remove the *really jarring* unnecessary bloat from our mods. It's kind of hard to play with all VE mods at the same time right now, as there is JUST SO MUCH CONTENT. We need to do a little cull to make space for more content, you know.

So here, I do what I never thought I will do: I ask you:

Is there any element, object, animal, entity or a mechanic of any of our mods that you'd like to see removed?

I'm not asking you to provide me with new mechanics to incorporate such content so it stays. I'm only asking this: is there anything you'd see removed. Anything you never used, perhaps? Anything that annoys you?

Please, don't worry about my feelings. Pop your suggestions in the comments.

I leave you with a never-before-seen redrawn Maynard Medieval to inspire your bloat hunting endeavour:


Comments

Anonymous

Suggestions: Split some features off from each other, allowing players to pick and choose more easily A lot of complaints I've seen stem from how content is displayed, perhaps a vanilla expanded menu overhaul would help A more drastic solution, reused from my last suggestion, would be to change research, implementing some of the research as optional "side-grades", for example making dressers vs wardrobes mutually exclusive (maybe adding a way to research both at extra cost), makeshift lasers exclusive with normal lasers, with differences in research affecting how long it takes to research them, and maybe require balancing the item stats Unrelated, but are there any plans for a pollution system, maybe in arkology? it just feels weird that no matter how large my robot powered factories or disposal fire pits get natures just outside, chillin. This next bit is just a repost of my old suggestion because I posted it really late, feel free to ignore: I don't know if you already have something planned, but for the Rim-effect mods, indoctrination would be cool. factions, maybe including player factions, could find/take technology from destroyed reaper landings to research or use and if not properly shielded they become indoctrinated (forced hostile to other factions, access to reaper tech, maybe some husks/pawns with husk hediffs), indoctrinated pawns when recruited by the player have a chance to become traitors/commit die, and if player indoctrination is a thing they get access to easy recruitment or event reaper forces but face raids from every other non-indoctrinated faction and must raid other factions near constantly to balance it On an unrelated note, a research expansion with research requiring building prototypes and maybe even small choices during prototyping (like do you want slightly more efficient batteries or slightly larger capacity, kind of like the Zerg evolution in StarCraft 2) would be cool. thanks for all the mods btw

Anonymous

this might be the opposite of removing bloat, but i think that the cooler from vfe:classical is a silly way of going about it. i get that a lot of the things in vfe:c are meant to let you get neolithic alternatives to lategame things (bronze tiles for example) so you can play the game without neolithic being a curse, but i think wood-powered freezer is silly. so uhhh here you go https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windcatcher Windcatcher. Material: 50-100ish stony. Size 2x2 or 3x3. Impassable, counts as wall. Cools adjacent rooms based on the wind level. The strength of this effect is increased based on how many tiles of the windcatcher are outside the room. Windcatchers also become weaker if they are too close to other windcatchers (5-10 radius circle). Qanat/cooling aqueduct/cooling channel/whatever. Material: 5ish stony. Built like pipes. Functions like vents, equalizing the temperature of all rooms it runs through. If the qanat is touching a windcatcher, the rooms are cooled slightly more. If the qanat touches water, the rooms are cooled even more. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pot-in-pot_refrigerator https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Botijo Cooling pot/Botijo/Zeer/Whatever. 25ish stony. 1x1 container. Cools whichever foods are placed within. Gameplay intention: Each one of these is its own separate way of cooling a room, and they all stack. As you add each one of these to your food storage, it gets that little bit colder, until the food inside your cooling pots is under 5 degrees, causing it to last months or years longer.

Mielga

1 the helixien gas has more potential than meets the eye IMO, but the positioning and quantity of extracted gas makes it insignificant, basically the main function for it is permanent lighting of freezers resistant to solar flares, and with the removal of gas vents, you cant even commit proper warcrimes with it 2 the cheese production is basically meaningless when combined with Vnl Trading, cuz there is no point in making higher quality cheese for your pawns moreover on the 2nd point the mecha cheese you get from combining cooking expanded and genetics expanded has an extremely low production rate, has no difference in whether or not it is poor quality or legendary and doesnt even show in the drug list, and it is essentially a drug, a very very difficult drug to make also, if you have cooking, genetics, mechanoids and outposts you can produce 25 of it every quadrum, even tho if you do it in your colony you need dozens and dozens of mechamuffallos and dozens of cheese press' so in this form, the gas is basically bloat with untapped potential (iirc the power mod was supposed to bring pollution) and the cheese is in an extremely weird place :)

Anonymous

I may be in the minority, but i'm not that into the combat aspect of rimworld. I would be totally fine with less weapon and armor options.

Anonymous

Honestly, a lot of the new furniture that is present seems like they all serve these similar roles. Maybe some type of converting old furniture resources into style packs instead? Overall the diversity is good, especially for themed runs, but styles seem to be a great way to get past that hurdle without filling the menus with a lot of things we will never use

Stim

There are some redundancies in armor and weapons, some clothes and so on. While some is downright central to things in the mod, some can be done without. HOWEVER I suggest there be some sort of "lite version" launched instead of straight up removing stuff. Some people might like them.

Bruh Box

For me, it's just the pawn styling stuff added in Vikings, it's completely redundant with Ideology adding the Styling Station

Anonymous

I think the biggest issue is that there are so many research options to choose from, it can be a little overwhelming. Some mods do a decent job of rebalancing vanilla expanded stuff, such as Vanilla Expanded Rebalanced and Vanilla Expanded - Raccoon's Patch, which both make a lot of good changes, however they don’t do everything. I would streamline most of the research by either reducing research cost or moving items into other research projects. Other things just need to be rebalanced or made more unique, like the guardian armor from VFE Vikings and the heavy plate armor from VFE Medieval have a lot of overlap, so maybe change some of the stats for the sets. There's not a good reason to make the makeshift weapons and the salvaged laser weapons, for the makeshift weapons I would just lower the research cost, but for the salvaged lasers maybe remove some of them or remove the ability to craft them and give them to special raiders and outlanders. The gauss magnum and the gauss revolver are cool, but they have some overlap, so I would remove one or change one, I would nerf the heavy club from tribal, so it has an even lower swing speed than it already does, the regular club can be for more general usage while the heavy club can keep its stronger one-shot potential. Things to remove I would remove the shiv, the light club, the sling, throwing rocks, the compound bow, the hand cannon, the battle axe, the casual t-shirt, the tunic, the blouse, the sheriff shirt, the Chestplate, the plate helmet, and the light plate helmet. I would also remove a lot of the fish, or at least add an option to disable specific ones. I Would remove the vanometric power cell variants as I think the vanometric power cell is unique enough on its own. Things to remove or rebalance I would either remove or rebalance the tomahawk, the tribal axe, the plate shoulder pads, remove and/or nerf most of the tools, the double action revolver, the volcanic pistol and remove or change the charge smg, as I feel it is too similar to the charge rifle. Nerf the shirt and tie as it is better than the button down shirt in nearly every way, despite being cheaper to make and having less sell value. The mending tables from VFE Ancients are quite strong, since you can extend the shelf life of a suit of marine armor you might get from a ruin, not only for a relatively cheap price, but also for a long time. As such the mending tables should probably be removed or severely nerfed in some way. I would also either remove or nerf the halberd, or maybe just change the research placement as it is very strong. Things to Rebalance I would slightly increase the cool down for the double-barreled shotgun and the repeating shotgun. slightly lower the range of the lever-action shotgun and the service rifle. A slight range or damage increase for the battle rifle would make it a more viable choice. To give it more of a unique niche I would give the pdw better armor penetration, as currently it has too much in common with the automatic pistol. The hmg is in a pretty good place, but I would slightly lower its armor penetration to 35%, as its armor penetration is the same as the charge weapons. The summer hat is at the moment just worse than the cowboy hat. The boots and gloves also need their insulation nerfed. I would nerf the wood armor and move chain mail to the middle layer. I know the base game lets you make armor out of wood, but running into centurions with wooden helmets makes them easier targets, so I would remove wood as a stuffable for the metal armors, although the classical armors themselves should probably be nerfed, as a centurion helmet is better than a flak one (maybe give them offsets while lowering their armor?). If possible it would be cool if the laser weapons required tech prints if the player has royalty (I don’t know how feasible this is since I am not a modder, but lore wise I just think it would be a nice change). The wall lights and torches could probably use some sort of nerf since they don’t take up space like regular lights do, maybe increase power cost or make them more expensive to make. The trash bins, while great quality of life additions, need some sort of nerf, as not only do I not need a dedicated janitor anymore, but there also isn’t much point in building the auto-cleaners from VFE Mechanoids as the large bin can do everything they can while being much cheaper and without needing to recharge. Maybe someone has to empty the bins every once in a while, or maybe they could increase cleaning speed while some sort of robo bin does what the bins do now. Some of the perks from VFE Classical could be rebalanced as well, currently I find Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum to be incredibly strong, especially for medical personnel. I think the passive cooler could use a nerf, maybe change it so the cooler refrigerates foods as opposed to freezing them, or you could give it another fuel type in a way similar to El's tribal water. Chemshine is pretty good for how easy it is to make, maybe give a -1 or -2 debuff so beer is still an option. Vanilla Expanded Rebalanced nerfs a lot of the VE apparel clothing and rebalances a lot of other stuff pretty well, I would recommend including the changes that the mod makes. Vanilla Expanded - Raccoon's Patch does a good job of rebalancing accessories and putting them in the game world, I would also recommend including a lot of the changes this mod makes as well. Some misc changes Some stuff just needs to be moved around, a lot of the furniture could be changed into texture variants, like the ones in Vanilla textures expanded variations. Items like this include the weapon rack, the royal poster bed, pottery from Vanilla Furniture Expanded, carvings, obelisks, statues, the 1x1 circular table from settlers, the post from settlers, and the bar stool. It would be cool if the face paint from vfe vikings would move into the styling bench if the player has Ideology as well. A lot of items really only exist for the player, so making them more common in the game world is important. I am not sure if it is a bug, but it would be cool if the medieval factions used the catapult. The mods I mentioned before do this to some degree, as well as Shavius’s vanilla expanded patches, personally I have always wanted to see pawns from the settler factions use the gatling gun in some shape or form. I believe that someone else mentioned it, but changing the resupply cost for the grenade belt would be nice, as the main thing that stops me from using them is bills that I have to make to refill them. As a final suggestion, maybe move some buildables into dropdown menus, [ZEN] Dropdown Menus Expanded Collection does this for a lot of the earlier VE stuff, however the mod hasn't been updated in a while. I think that these changes would be good at making certain items more standout while reducing bloat and increasing game balance overall. I suggest these changes having used all of the aforementioned items, these are just the changes I could think of. Apologies if these suggestions are unhelpful or annoying.

Dom Speziale

I know I’m really late for this post (I just joined silver tier), and I don’t know if my comment will be seen, but if I may add my opinion; I wouldn’t want to see anything removed, and I put emphasis on my statement. All the features in your mods are a breath of fresh air, and the content (even the slightest feature) is what brings people towards your mods. I don’t know how you operate your modding career or the specifics of it, but I think a good idea would be to work with Tynan once more to integrate selected Vanilla Expanded mods to put them into the game so it becomes official content (just like VE hair, and VE livestock). At one point or another in the future there will be a plethora of VE mods out there that you and your team will release to public which means that even if you remove “bloat” or specific features from past mods, there would still be far too many mods for people PCs to handle. It’s best that people just download which mods they want to play with, and mix them after each play-through. You and your team do a fantastic job of bringing Rimworld to life with not just your VE series of mods, but with all mods you and the team release. It would be a shame to see even the slightest feature be deleted. I hope you guys see my message and as always, I applaud you for the hard work!

oskarpotocki
>>88787611

Fear not: I promise, if we remove something, it’s only to give it a new purpose (or because vanilla game already has something like that)

Anonymous

Sorry I’m late but this issue is important to me. To be honest I couldn’t name anything specifically that I want removing because it’s more about HOW the huge amounts of content puts itself into that game that causes issues. For example if I had all of VE installed and I caravan to a trader looking for something specific, it’s really unlikely that I’m gonna find that thing since it’s heavily outnumbered by all the VE stuff when generating stock. Which is just frustrating because it could take days and tonnes of food to find the item I want to buy. What’s also a huge issue for me is the way the VE stuff dominates any UI. Trying to add a bill to a workbench? Good luck finding the thing you want. Trying to find what you want in the build menu? You’ll spend ages looking and the vanilla search function is rather poor (can’t search all menus + unintuitive lists). Plus I now have to build everything bigger to fit in all the workbench boosters I love the apparel stuff that helps out with specific jobs because it adds flavour to the pawns appearances, the only thing is it creates huge management headaches. If I wanna use that I have to work out which pawns need the different items, assign them an outfit or force wear, then assign them a separate outfit so they can get changed for battle, create a place to store the battle wear to it’s easily accessible, then put them back into their outfits after the raid which may not be possible since people will be downed. VE creates more research which isn’t always bad… but you can only research one thing at a time, and the more mods you have the more stuff you wanna research which in turn just delays the ending to the game and delays getting important stuff like advanced components and bionics. My last run I mainly focused on genetics expanded, warcaskets and SRTS. By the time I got to advanced components I was at the endgame waiting for the archocentipede to grow. I never even got to making any bionics or power armours and half my pawns had lost their legs! In conclusion running all of VE creates large amounts of additional management and time wasting. This takes away from the more enjoyable gameplay. I don’t think Rimworld is designed to handle that many items, it wouldn’t be difficult for Tynan to add additional items like VE has but he has chosen not to because he doesn’t see the need. I’m not saying VE stuff should be removed or that it has no value, I just feel there needs to be a fundamental change in how Rimworld implements the mods so we can enjoy them without having any of the negatives associated with “bloat”