Grilling JR - The Rock 1996-97 [Show Notes] (Patreon)

Jim - today’s episode is the 3 year anniversary of the beginning of Grilling JR! How does that make you feel?

Today we’re going to be discussing - in my opinion - the biggest wrestling star in professional wrestling - and how he was first found and his first years in the wrestling business.

Of course we’re discussing Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson. The Rock just turned 50 this past week Jim! Jim - when is the name Dwayne Johnson first presented to you?

The narrative has always been - between Pat Patterson, Jim Cornette and countless others - that they saw a megastar instantly. Did you?

You’ve talked in the past about your first meeting with him and we all know the Seven Bucks story - but what was it about him?

Now looking back 25 years or so - and how much the business has changed - did signing the Rock lay the groundwork for future signings of what ends up being a good college athlete that just wasn’t good enough for the professional scene?

With knowing what you know now…would the Rock had made it out of NXT or in the current landscape of how talent is developed - compared to going to Memphis and learning the craft?

Rocky isn’t wrestling long before debuting in a dark match in Corpus Christi in a win over the Brooklyn Brawler Steve Lombardi. What do you remember of this match?

Rocky is put with Chris Candido in a dark match just a few days later - it’s important to get someone like the Rock in the ring with as many good workers as possible is it not?

What was Rocky Johnson’s influence if any during the early parts of the Rock’s career?

Can it be accurately conveyed what working with Jerry Lawler in Memphis did for Maivia?

Was JR getting tapes of all Rock’s Memphis stuff? Or just kept up to date about him from others?

With Rocky working in Memphis he’s brought to TV occasionally even getting to wrestle Owen Hart. You’re looking for the feedback of these guys in the ring with him to see how he’s progressing right?

On August 24th, with time running out on the live TV show, Flex Kavana challenged Lawler for the title and said he'd leave town if he lost. With about 15 seconds left in the TV show, Lawler hit Kavana with a chain and as they went off the air they announced Kavana was gone. You knew at this point he was ready for the main roster - is that based solely off the King’s opinion? The long time narrative has always been that when Vince thinks someone’s ready he’s going to be brought up regardless…was that the case here?


-Vignettes begin airing in late October with Kevin Kelly on the weekend shows to hype up his debut and explaining Rock’s family history and a clip inducting his father into the Cauliflower Alley Club. That’s not really something Vince does often and it shows how special having the first 3rd generation talent in WWF history to be Rocky. Everyone knew he was different did they not?

He actually makes his first TV appearance on November 4th, 1996 on Raw when he’s at ringside to back up the Survivor Series team he’ll be making his in-ring debut with. Could you imagine looking back 25 years later the biggest mega star is first highlighted in a walk out role while Barry Windham is taking on Goldust?

At the 1996 Survivor Series Rocky makes his debut as he’s the sole survivor for his team…in Madison Square Garden. When you take a look back at this show it’s hard not to notice how much of a launching point this is for the WWF…Rocky’s first match…Steve Austin losing to Bret Hart but really being elevated into a top spot and Shawn Michaels dropping the title to Sid but showing off an edge against a hostile New York crowd. How big a moment is this in the WWF’s quest to regain the top spot from WCW?

He’s really just defeating at the time enhancement guys like TL Hopper and Salvatore Sincere and even turns down Jim Cornette who’s trying to manage him. It’s an intended slow burn of Rocky is it not?

We covered his IC title win over Hunter on Thursday Raw Thursday so be sure to check that our in the archives but the over exposure that is often talked about for Rocky at this time isn’t really true. He’s not on Raw for a couple weeks after this - was it a conscience part in creative to not overexpose him?

Did you start to hear the rejection of Rocky before the IC title win, during the title victory or after?

It’s hard to get a fiery white meat babyface over while at the same time you have Bret Hart cursing in the ring, Steve Austin giving the double bird, and the anti-hero sentiment of gimmicks like the nWo excelling?

At Final Four & WrestleMania Rocky retains his IC title twice over Triple H and then Sultan and for the first time Rocky Johnson comes out to help fight off Bob Backlund & the Iron Sheik…but at this point in time was it thought…we may need to pull back on his push?

Last week we watched the Raw is War where he lost the IC title to Owen Hart. Do you sit with Rocky at this time - are you yelling at creative - we have something here - he needs some confidence - how do you fix a foundering talent as is obvious here?

Rocky loses to Mankind at Cold Day in Hell and Mick Foley even wrote in his book he didn’t think Maivia had it. In commentary that night you even say that in Rocky’s win over Hunter back in February that the better man didn’t win on that night and he was an unsuccessful IC champion. What was it Jim? Did you know he needed a refresh already?

Can that be something that hurts a talent? I mean Ric Flair talks constantly about how when he lost his confidence it was a major blow to him. And that’s someone who had done it all already. What’s it like when it’s someone who hasn’t yet?

Rocky hurts his knee and ends up missing a few months. Was that injury - again in hindsight - a blessing in disguise?

Was there a plan to already turn him heel before the injury?

During his time off for his knee are you in regular contact with him?

Where is his head at?

Obviously the Rock is notorious for pushing forward and not letting things get to him as evidenced by all his success in really every venture. There was no doubt in your mind this young man could fail right?

Rocky returns to the WWF at house shows defeating Faarooq & Rockabilly. Were there any other plans that you know of for his return to be anything but a heel?

Putting him with the Nation sort of seemed out of nowhere. There’s no vignettes about his return. No build up promo. Was it a sort of…hey Rocky we have you coming back to Raw and we’ll figure out when you get here type of thing?

On Raw on August 11th, 1997 Rocky Maivia comes out of the crowd to interfere in a match between Chainz - Brian Lee - and Faarooq.

The Rock embraces destiny with him turning heel and joining the Nation and he shows 15x more charisma in just two minutes than he did really during the beginning of his entire run at the start. Was this just miscasting for Rocky?

Pairing him up to be under the wing so to speak with Ron Simmons … Faarooq … was that something done to give Rock some experience of working with a seasoned veteran or was it because you could build to a separation and a program between the two of them?

Here is Rock’s first promo after turning heel on Raw from August 18th, 1997.

Quite quickly you can see he’s much more comfortable talking and acting like a heel. Was this finally the right creative for him?

Gang Wars were a central point of the WWF in late 1997. Between the Nation, the Disciples of Apocalypse, Los Boricuas, and really an extension of that the Hart Foundation…all these stables being put together…it’s a ton of talent put into these groups. Did you have an excess of talent here and you’re just hoping some of them stick to become stars.

In October there’s a segment between the Nation and the Hart Foundation that really brings up some deep issues including racism. Is this something you wish hadn’t been a part of the WWF at the time?

Ahmed Johnson - who had about 2 weeks in the Nation before getting hurt - returns and puts together what just months earlier would’ve been a strong babyface group of himself, Ken Shamrock and the Legion of Doom. The Nation at the time was Faarooq, the Rock, D’Lo Brown & Kama Mustafa. There’s a ton of big time talent between these 8 men and they’re scheduled to take each other on at the Survivor Series. Rock and Shamrock had a lot of chemistry in the ring together did they not?

The Nation would lose at Survivor Series but really the story coming out of that is obviously the Montreal Screwjob. With the Hart Foundation really going away there’s an open spot for another top heel to step forward and to be programmed against Steve Austin. Why do you think it was Rock?

Did Steve see something in the Rock or was it Vince pushing for this?

Do you know if Rock ever got any heat from Faarooq or anybody else?

Was it Rocky who came up with calling himself, “The Rock?”

This is really when that begins and starts to get hammered home. Everything you’ve been waiting for for his career is really about to begin isn’t it?

Do you think the crowd rejecting Rock earlier in the year and now being with the Nation makes him an easy target for Steve…but is Steve being the one here being used to elevate Rock?

Rock’s comedic timing and Austin’s ability to draw a reaction is put on display in no bigger outlet than the Rock/Austin 3:16 beeper segment on Raw.

-Rock/Austin 3:16 beeper segment RAW 11/24/97

Austin and Rock are scheduled for Steve’s first Intercontinental title defense at In Your House: DX. Austin really still isn’t up to full speed from his neck injury but they still put on a hell of a show. From the Observer:

“7. Steve Austin pinned Rocky Maivia in 5:32 to retain the IC title. Austin came to the ring in his truck and got by far the best reaction of anyone on the show. The entire NOD attacked Austin, but he made his own comeback and backdropped D-Lo Brown over the top rope and he broke the windshield in landing. Austin then gave him a stunner on the roof of the truck. Match had super heat. After a Thesz press, Austin was destroying Maivia until taking a bump to the floor, where Faarooq and Kama attacked him. Faarooq went to hit Austin with a chair, but he moved and Kama took the blow. Austin whipped Kama into the truck. In the ring, Maivia used the dreaded overdone low blow on Austin but missed an elbow drop. After more distractions, Austin put the stunner on the ref who he thought was Maivia. He then used the stunner on Maivia and a second ref ran in to make the count. You can't expect Austin to have the kind of matches he had in the past due to his injuries, but given his limitations, this was pretty entertaining.” **1/4

This was the best use of Austin here with all the smoke and mirrors but Rock is the perfect foil for him is he not?

Also from the Observer:

“In the case of Austin, the original plan was for him to lose the title at the 12/7 PPV to

Rocky Maivia. When he balked, a compromise was worked out where instead he got over

his defiant anti-establishment role, Maivia got the title although the reasons clearly made

no sense and Austin didn't have to do a job. As best we can tell, there was no heat

regarding what ended up happening as everyone involved in the decision making process

was comfortable with the compromise although the end result was a storyline that made

no logical sense in regard to Maivia ending up with the title. The approach Austin took,

basically since the current plan is for him to win the WWF title at Wrestlemania from

Michaels, is that since he's headlining Mania, he didn't think it would be good for him to

do a high-profile job to a heel who is just getting established as a top name like Maivia,

even though no doubt the finish would have involved tons of outside interference. Not to

mention that unlike in his past, his physical limitations wouldn't allow him to put on a

great match in a losing effort. Whether one agrees with the logic or his side of things, and

it isn't believed that he has creative control clause in his deal with Vince McMahon like

Hart did, there is a logical argument that can be made if you want to take that side. Austin

shouldn't be the IC champion today. He's unable to work lengthy singles matches and

that title belt won't make him any more of a star than not having it. The title belt will be a

big help in elevating Maivia, although he would be helped that much more as a new

superstar if he actually won the belt from Austin. At the same time, the argument could

be made that Austin should be protected from doing a job since he is going to headline

Mania not to mention that he's currently the hottest star in the industry. Should he wrestle Maivia again with his limitations, unless they had a truck parked in the aisle again as a gimmick and had D-Lo Brown going through the windshield, they would be hard pressed to have a good match. But that line of logic hardly makes sense for the second scenario.”

There’s a lot of guys who get a lot of shit for not dropping titles. Shawn Michaels especially. Why do you think Austin “gets a pass” so to speak regarding this?

Do you know if Rock held it against him at any point in time?

-Austin forfeits IC title RAW 12/8/97

-RAW 12/15/97 Austin throws IC belt in river

But my god Jim…how good is all this?

Rock will begin to transition to feuding with Ken Shamrock and the tease of the Nation’s break up but that’s a story for 1998!

It’s crazy that in just a 1 ½ year period Rock goes from a blue chip rookie to one of the best heels in the business by the end of 1997. Did you think the sky was the limit at this point?