Grilling JR - RAW Watchalong 02.03.97 [Show Notes] (Patreon)

Today on Grilling JR we’re going to be doing a watchalong of the first ever 2-hour Monday Night Raw episode from February 3rd, 1997 in the Toronto Skydome.

We’re going to have you fire up your Peacock machine…Monday Night Raw Season 5 episode 5 and as we get ready to count it down Jim I’m excited to continue our look back at 25 years as just a few weeks ago we discussed Royal Rumble 1997.

I saw the feedback on you & Conrad’s episode on Bret Hart’s Heel Turn in 1997 and it was some of the best feedback I’ve seen! Did you see the same?

You & Conrad touched on Bret’s performance the night after the Rumble on Raw but that show featured Bret quitting then returning for the announcement of the Final Four to determine who would take on Shawn Michaels at WrestleMania. But this was from the Observer: “Don't be surprised to see either major or minor changes in regard to Monday Night Raw. The rating on 1/20, where WWF came the day after a major PPV show where it changed the world title and had a controversial Rumble finish and opened a hot Raw show with Bret Hart quitting, and Nitro still won the hour handily and scored a tremendous second hour rating were major causes of concern for both WWF and USA network.”

How quick does this come from USA and why is the decision made to make Raw 2 hours?

Now this episode is 2 hours but the next show - the infamous Thursday Raw Thursday which sees Shawn Michaels’ lose his smile - is moved because of the Westminster Dog Show…how much did everyone hate the Westminster Dog Show?

Meltzer in the Observer reports that the original plan for this very episode was to air the Royal Rumble in this spot but there’s an agreement between pay-per-view carriers that you can’t do that. So literally on January 29th - the decision is made that it will be a 2 hour show. From there the next show is two days later for the World Wrestling Federation and it’s at the Skydome in Toronto. Was this always supposed to be a TV shoot?

I ask because the crowd isn’t well miced, it doesn’t look like a normal TV shoot with some subpar lighting…doesn’t seem like the well oiled production the WWF is known for…

“Vader beat Steve Austin via DQ in 8:13 when Austin gave the ref a stone cold stunner. Before the match, Bret Hart jumped Austin and they had a short brawl. Vader, who may not be 100% due to pneumonia, didn't look good and Austin wasn't good enough to carry the match. *”

The brawl was better than the match Jim. Was Austin not good enough as Dave says here or is just Vader too sick for Steve to really get anything out of Leon?

Vince calls the crowd a capacity crowd here where the show is only half full. Did Vince have issues with lying about attendance like that? There’s always been stories that he’s gone back and forth on announcing these things.

Working with Vince & Doot Doot Doot here - Vince talks about how there won’t be any bait & switches like with WCW but doesn’t mention WCW. Does Vince like doing those things back then?

Is it a tough booth with Vince & Michael?

Vader & Austin disappear into darkness really to end the match.

3. Savio Vega pinned Flash Funk in 4:21 after a missed moonsault. A disappointing match as well. Highlight was Funk doing a plancha onto D-Lo Brown outside the ring just before the finish. 1/2*

Savio is part of the Nation here and yeah these two just didn’t click either. This is the beginning of their tour so is this just a couple of days rest coming back to Toronto and having to cross the border, etc because everyone looks sluggish…

“Sid did his first interview since losing the title, and it wasn't a good one.”

Sid was never a strong promo but rarely had someone speak for him in this era. Was anyone ever considered? There had to be someone that could talk for him right?

“4. Phil LaFon & Doug Furnas beat Owen Hart & Davey Boy Smith via count out in a tag title match in 14:30. Furnas was suffering from the flu. Match wasn't what you'd expect from the four but it was still decent. Much of it was teasing the eventual Hart-Smith break-up. Finish was a bad one on a night filled with bad ones. Smith accidentally backdropped Owen over the top rope and he was counted out on the floor, so the title didn't change. They did an angle where Owen was faking his knee injury in front of Smith, but dancing behind his back, giving the impression he took the count out to keep the title on purpose. **¼”

We’re building to Owen & Davey for the European title but at this point do you know the Hart Foundation deal is going to be happening or is the plan to split these two.

Phil LaFon & Doug Furnas. We don’t talk a lot about them and you know Furnas’ career real well. What can you tell our listeners about both of these men and as a tag team?

Did LaFon & Furnas have a chance to get over in the WWF?

Ahmed Johnson cuts a promo. Jeez two babyface promos in a row where…not a whole lot of sense happens. Not the strongest showing huh?

“5. Crush pinned Goldust with a heart punch after outside interference from Vega. Really bad. Crush looks menacing standing there but he's a total zip once the bell rings and Goldust is dying so far as a face. DUD”

Where was Crush at at this point? Was there something there with him?

Dustin was just stuck in this rut as a babyface was he not?

HHH interferes as we continue the story with Goldust. Is Chyna on your radar at this point?

Savio interferes at the end…and this is a lot of protection for Goldust. Did Vince feel it necessary to protect Dustin?

The New Blackjacks! This is the hope to really start Bradshaw’s career and save Windham’s correct?

“The best part of the show was the Shawn Michaels-Bret Hart confrontation. It was acknowledged that this was in Bret's home town (like the entire country of Canada is one town) to explain Michaels being booed. As Michaels came out, Ross said he wasn't bald and he doesn't make promises he can't keep, apparently in reference to Hogan not wrestling Piper on the other station. Hart came out to the big face pop and actually outshined Michaels in this segment. Just as it appeared they were going to come to blows, Austin jumped Bret and they brawled while Michaels just stood there.”

The shot at Hogan and Piper…is that Vince feeding you?

Shawn compares himself to Muhammad Ali…that was a stretch was it not?

Bret calls Shawn a degenerate which is tremendous foreshadowing. Austin & Sid come out and it’s all brawls. Just the fact that you’re 10 days away from literally throwing the whole card out when Shawn loses his smile…it’s crazy to think about that now isn’t it?

Before the show Meltzer notes the following, “They had an in-ring contract signing deal with numerous WWF officials and businessmen including Hisashi Shinma, the former WWF figurehead President and Chairman of the Board of New Japan in a previous generation, Ryuma Go of the Samurai Project promotion in Japan, several Indian types, McMahon, Bruce Prichard, Bret Hart and others to sign the son of Tiger Jeet Singh, who will wrestle as Tiger Ali Singh, with the idea of pushing him as a major star both in Canada and overseas.”

How the hell does this all come together? This is a set of names here. How big a part of this was Bret?

“6. Hunter Hearst Helmsley retained the IC title pinning Marc Mero after hitting him with Knux in 13:57. Easily the best match on the show. They announced both managers were barred from ringside. Actually Sable was recovering from surgery (which is why Mero missed shows last weekend) and Curtis the Butler was having problems with his high blood pressure and given the weekend off. Both worked very hard. ***¼”

Was Mr. Hughes already done at this point?

What was Sable’s surgery do you remember at this time?

Hunter is getting better and these two in the ring were always good together. What was it about their working styles you think that just meshed well?

“7. Undertaker & Ahmed Johnson beat Faarooq & Mankind in a no DQ match in 10:29. Vader interfered in the finish going after Undertaker but instead hit Mankind with a chair by accident when Undertaker moved, to heat up their eventual feud. Johnson brawled out of the ring with Faarooq, Crush and D-Lo Brown, who still doesn't have a name while Ross talked about the brawling saying that those guys aren't has-beens. Vader then hit Undertaker with a chair but he didn't sell it and knocked Vader out of the ring. Undertaker pinned Mankind after a tombstone on the chair. Mankind did a real good job in this match including getting a chair in his face from an Undertaker kick and also throwing powder in Undertaker's eyes. **¾”

This…isn’t great but it’s better than what the other side is putting out as you put out. Did those in the WWF watch Nitro and wonder why you were losing the ratings?

Speaking of ratings this show gets a 2.64 rating and a 3.9 share and while WCW is promoting a Hogan vs. Piper match on the other channel that never happens which you guys point out throughout the show … Nitro gets a 3.04 rating and a 4.6 share.

Did you, Vince & Hayes do the commentary live in the studio from tape? Are you monitoring Nitro at the same time? What’s it like sitting next to Vince when doing this?

Bret wrote this in the Calgary Sun at the time and I have to bring it up to you: “Bret Hart in the Calgary Sun over the weekend on his role model, Hulk Hogan:"WCW has something far worse than bad referees, they have Hulk Hogan. Hogan lost his flair so long ago that it boggles my mind why people would want to tune into that.

Watching myself plod along like Hogan, an old, pathetic embarrassment would be too much for me to take. When I walk out, whether it is three months from now or three years from now, I will hold my head high. Perhaps the strongest reason I didn't go to WCW is because I pictured myself getting lost in the shuffle in a deck of cards filled with Hulk Hogan. One thing about the WWF in contrast to WCW is that we almost always take their previous stars and make them brighter and they take our stars and make them dimmer. I'm sure Diesel and Razor are quickly finding out what it's like to be on the Hulk Hogan show. They smile when they go to the bank but they cry themselves to sleep.”

Did Bret ever catch heat from Vince or anyone in the office from writing something like that in his column?

Raw eventually moves to two hours full time later that month - do you as head of talent relations need to start bringing in more talent or do you have enough talent at that time?

Let’s get to some fan questions Jim!

AFS Top Guy Patrick Ruth wants to know, “How was the morale at this point backstage during the Monday night war?”

AFS My Push member Yambag Jones wants to know,

• “Who was more underrated, Savio Vega or Flash Funk?”
• Has there ever been more of an odd couple pairing than Undertaker and Ahmed?

Chris Mason - Jim how exciting was it to take the weekly television to such a huge venue?

Robert Palmer - We know that JR is a huge OU fan. Which pro teams in all sports does he follow and which Wrestlers are die hard fans of teams? Does JR have any good stories of watching games with the boys?

Next week Jim we’ll be discussing Sting’s 1990-1991 run. We’ll be talking about Sting getting kicked out of the Four Horsemen, blowing out his knee, Sting being on TV during his injury, RoboCop, Sting finally beating Ric Flair for the NWA Title, the Black Scorpion, dropping the title to Flair in a blizzard, Lex Luger, Nikita Koloff, Steve Austin, Rick Rude and so much more! What is the first thing that jumps off the page with that list?