The Kurt Angle Show - Iron Man Match w/ Shawn Michaels: Raw 10.03.05 Watchalong [Show Notes] (Patreon)

The story of you vs. Shawn Michaels is one of the best of all-time professional wrestling programs and it’s crazy to say this...you only wrestled 3 times! This is remembered as two of the best ever in the ring showing off their skills in a way that few other can...with almost three 30 minute matches on the biggest platforms and shows in WWE history.

The rivalry begins before WrestleMania 21 and that was one of our first episodes so be sure to check it out in the archives. Coming off of WrestleMania 21 you’re on SmackDown and Shawn is on Raw. As crazy as that sounds now there really was an attempt to keep the brands separated back then. Was there any talk of re-visiting you vs Shawn after the match or was it determined at that point it was just a one-time WrestleMania moment type of thing?

There’s an interesting interview you give to the Peoria Journal and this line in particular stands out, “I’ve wrestled everybody on Smackdown more than once. I love wrestling the Eddie Guerreros and Rey Mysterios and guys like that. But there are guys on Raw that I haven’t wrestled in years or have never wrestled. I would like to make a move and have a chance to be the franchise on Raw.”

At this point you had been on SmackDown since March of 2001 and it’s June of 2005 so over 4 years on one brand. Were you really bored with being on Smackdown and looking for a fresh start?

Are you communicating to the creative team and Vince that you would like to move to Raw?

How are you told you’ll be moving to Raw and what is the goal?

On Raw from June 13th here’s the Observer recap:

“Angle came out as the new guy. HHH welcomes him to the big leagues. Angle did a whoo-off with Flair, then HHH said it was gimmick infringement. This was lasting forever and getting nowhere until Angle told HHH that he used to fool around with HHH’s wife behind her back. Zing. The money line. The crowd buzzed about that one. HHH then laughed about it, and

said everyone fooled around with his ex-wife. So next week it’s Angle vs. Batista as the

main event. Michaels then came back and said he had no dance partner for the PPV, and challenged Angle. Angle accepted to a lukewarm response. Then, Angle, Flair, HHH, Batista and Michaels had a sloppy brawl.”

So your first time on Raw in years and it’s based around a promo off with HHH & Flair and then out of nowhere Shawn challenges you to a pay-per-view match and you brawl with Batista to setup next week. The draft times as we we’ve discussed in the past had a lot of messy creative but this just screams lack of long term planning. Were you excited to be wrestling Shawn as your first big pay-per-view match back on Raw?

Is there talk of another match between you & Shawn in a best of 3 series or is it just kind of week by week and we’ll see what happens?

How do you compare working with Shawn Michaels with anyone else? More so asking was there anyone like him before or after you worked with?

If there’s no comparison to him, who would you say was the closest to him in terms of ideas and what it takes to be a worker?

On Raw the next week you go one-on-one with Batista that ends after 2 minutes and it turns into you & HHH against Batista & HBK. That’s a lot of talent in one ring to end a TV show. Were you happy to be on Raw at this point?

At Vengeance the rematch between you & Shawn takes place and Shawn evens the score at 1-1. From the Observer:

“Shawn Michaels pinned Kurt Angle in 26:11. Another near classic performance. Angle at one point rolled through a sunset flip into a quick ankle ock. He used a German suplex onto the Spanish’s announcer’s table, which didn’t break. Michaels had a cut under his left eye, apparently from a Dory Funk style uppercut forearm. Angle threw him in the ring and German suplexed him to a near fall. Angle wound up with a bloody mouth. Michaels teased the first superkick but Angle leveled him with a hard clothesline. Angle went for the Angle slam, but it was reversed into an implant DDT for a near fall. Michaels went for a vertical suplex, but Angle countered into a German suplex and an Angle slam for a near fall. Angle kept going for the ankle lock and they teased the Mania finish. Michaels kicked out of the ankle lock and Angle knocked down the ref. Angle backdropped Michaels over the top rope, and Michaels started selling his knee. He kept going back to the ankle lock. After Angle missed a tackle and flew into the post, Michaels hit the superkick. Angle kicked out of that. Angle then went to the top rope and came off, into a superkick, which resulted in the pin. They tried to do an offshoot of the Michaels-Benjamin Raw finish, but this wasn’t nearly as impressive or well timed. Still, it was among the best matches of the year. ****½”

Meltzer loved it and hard not to see why. I’ve always been fascinated with knowing this...guys who work series of matches with each other...do you go back and watch the first one to pick up on things to do differently? Do you call the first match knowing you were going to have a series and think of spots to do then that you can build off of later or do people like myself and other wrestling fans give you too much credit and look too deep into it regarding the move psychology?

Was Pat Patterson part of putting this series together for you or was it a different agent?

Did Shawn want his win or back or was it just the next logical step in the story?

There’s an interesting promo and match to talk about on the Raw the day after. From the Observer:

“Raw opened with Angle coming out. He teased the idea of challenging Shawn Michaels to a third match, as the main event, since they were one apiece. Angle explained he didn’t have to because his win was by submission at Wrestlemania. Michaels’ win was a fluke, and since his was at Mania, it counts for two. As silly as that sounds it’s actually true. So he said he’s done with Michaels, which is good, because it means they have to wrestle again. He wanted Batista. Flair came out and put Angle over, saying a bunch of things that he actually has privately said for years. He said if Angle avoids injury for the next few years, he can be the greatest wrestler of all-time. He said he rather his son grew up to be like Angle than like him, and said he’s a big mark for Angle. Somehow this led to heated feelings, and God knows how that happened. Flair promised to bite Angle’s fingers, squeeze his testicles, rip his mouth and gouge his eyes.”

I enjoy you talking about how you winning at WrestleMania and by submission means it’s really like having 2 wins over Shawn compared to his one. The things Flair talks about in his promo at the time had to be meaningful for you considering he would say those things privately. What was your relationship like with Ric and how much did you enjoy being around the Nature Boy?

From later that night:

“Angle beat flair in 17:18 of a ***½ match in their first ever meeting. Angle used a belly-to-belly on Flair on the floor and Flair ran into Angle and took a high backdrop from him on the floor. The story was that Flair would try and wrestle, Angle would get him in moves, and Flair would respond by playing dirtiest player in the game. From that sense, the match was super effective. They set up a superplex or top rope Angle slam spot, but Flair was out of position and Angle wasn’t letting him get in position, so Flair jumped to the floor. That looked bad. Flair kicked out of the Angle slam. When Angle went for the ankle lock, Flair did the testicle squeeze out of it. Place went nuts for the figure four. Angle got a rope break. Flair countered the rolling German suplex spot with a low blow. But Angle blocked a kneebreaker by Flair and put him in the ankle lock, then the heel hook, and got the tap.”

Kurt...Flair is 56 years old here. You’re not even 56 yet. How insane is Flair at this point? What was it like working with him and doing all this with him?

You’re working two of the biggest professional wrestling stars in the history of the business. How special is that to you at this point in your career?

Between then and the Shawn Michaels Iron Man Match you work a program with Eugene regarding your gold medals at SummerSlam and John Cena at Unforgiven which I’m sure we’ll cover at some point. Did you know the goal was to always get back to Shawn for the big Raw show?

Why is it a big Raw show? It’s called “Homecoming” as the WWE returns to the USA Network from Spike. What did you think of having such a high profile match being pushed as a central part of the return of Raw to the USA Network?

It’s a big show not just because of the move but because Spike is running a live UFC show to counter program it as they were not happy Raw was leaving. Was the pressure on and did Vince talk to you about how important this was match was?

Well let’s get to the watch along Kurt! Fire up the Peacock machine...Season 13...episode 40...at 17:29 is the time stamp and let’s talk about the rubber iron man match between you & Shawn.

As we get started and see your entrance...who’s idea was it for the Iron Man Match?

Crazy thing is here at 17:29 it’s the first match of the evening. Is it difficult to follow all the talking and stars that are shown (Roddy Piper, Mick Foley, Randy & Bob Orton) to get the fans into a 30 minute wrestling match?

What’s one thing about an Iron Man match fans should know about?

Did you guys call it in the ring as they say or did you have a good layout of what you were going to around the pinfalls?

From the Observer: “They wised up and did this before either the NFL or UFC started, because Iron Man matches don’t historically do well at holding viewers. This was so not in the league with the AJ Styles vs. Christopher Daniels Iron Man match earlier this year. Angle took a crazy bump over the top rope when he ran at Michaels, who backdropped him over, and he over rotated. Still, when Michaels went out, Angle got right up and gave him an Angle slam on the floor, and then power bombed him into the turnbuckles for a near fall. Angle ended up taking the first fall with an Angle slam off the middle ropes in 8:10. Michaels won the second in 14:47 when he countered an ankle lock into a front rolling cradle. Angle took the third in 18:43 with an ankle lock. Michaels hit an elbow drop off the top rope and sweet chin music to even it at 25:14. With time running out, Michaels did the Ray Stevens flip into the turnbuckles, and Angle used the Angle Slam for a near fall. He tried another Angle slam, but Michaels reversed it into a swinging DDT for a near fall. Michaels tried a moonsault block, but Angle rolled with it and ended up with an ankle lock. Michaels struggled, but refused to tap and eventually broke it. Michaels hit sweet chin music right at the bell and it was a draw. Michaels challenged Angle to continue it sudden death style, but Angle walked off and refused. The match wasn’t close to the level of their two prior big matches. TV commercial breaks didn’t help, nor did the flat finish. Unless they are going to rematch the two before Taboo Tuesday, it makes no sense for Angle not to win, since he’s getting the next title shot. ***¼”

Do you think commercial breaks hurt a match like this Kurt?

Can you compare this match to the first two with Shawn or is it a different beast because of the stipulation with it.

What did you like better, this match or the one-hour one with Brock on Smackdown?

How different is preparing for something like this compared to a normal 10 minute TV match or a 20 minute higher impact PPV match?