Grilling JR - Raw Roulette 2008 [Show Notes] (Patreon)

What better way for us to kick 2021 off than with a look at the WWE’s attempt to bring back Spin the Wheel, Make the Deal in 2008. Only, instead of doing it at Halloween Havoc, they did it at a casino!

We’re here today to talk about Raw Roulette 2008.

It happened on January 7, 2008 in Uncasville, Connecticut at the Mohegan Sun Casino Arena, of all places.

So clearly, between the shots of people in the casino throughout the night and the roulette wheel, this was planned as a theme for the night, right? Would that have been something the Casino paid for or was the company just showing off all their destinations?

The FIRST RAW Roulette was born in 2002 with Eric Bischoff as general manager of the brand. It was in Vegas.

Our commentary duo for the night is the iconic pairing of Jim Ross and Jerry “The King” Lawler.

Now, what’s cool about this show is...if you watched it live, at the time, on USA...you saw it in standard definition. But if you’re watching with us on the Network...you’re going to see it in HD for the first time! Sort of.

The company was in the middle of transitioning to HD and had already begun filming with HD cameras. However, the graphics are still standard def! So they don’t always match up or look as smooth as we’ve become accustomed to - but it’s proof that every operation, no matter how big, has growing pains!

You can watch us in HD, too, over at AdFreeShows.com.

News and Notes

We are told that at this point it looks like testing for marijuana in WWE will take place once per year. The failure is a $1000 fine and does not count as a Wellness Policy strike. So basically, if you're willing to pay $1000 a year you can smoke all the pot you want in WWE.

How far have we come?

Raw starts in HD in two weeks, so Royal Rumble won't be the first-ever WWE HD event. I'd have made people pay and started Raw and Smackdown immediately afterwards.

Even though the HD rollout wasn’t planned for the public until after the Rumble, the show we are watching tonight is in HD - partially, anyway. Some of the graphics are still in 4:3 ratio and don’t match up over the 16:9 widescreen format.

WWE got out there early with HD during a period where there weren’t a lot of options for it. Do you remember much worry, anxiety, or excitement about going HD? It makes it much easier to see blemishes now, right?

F4W: Triple H is about the most least-liked person in the company right now. People were very upset that he didn't make a stand to put over Flair last week in what is very likely (though this is wrestling) Flair's final match in Greensboro, NC. This has been building up for a long time. He's always had heat but it really picked up over the summer when he pretty much squashed Booker T at SummerSlam and Booker left the company for TNA shortly thereafter. Booker, as part of renegotiations, had been allowed to sit in on the booking meetings, hoping I guess to assure that nobody buried him and that he would be taken care of in the feud with Hunter. Well, he wasn't taken care of. The biggest reason he ultimately quit was the 60-day suspension, but after the Hunter thing we're told there was a good chance he was leaving anyway, plus everyone in WWE believes that's why he left. People really liked him, so they were very upset about how that all went down. Hunter also buried Jericho before Jericho even arrived, saying that the company may have had some rough shakes but now they were going to be OK because their savior was coming back. The feeling was that he was especially vindictive because Stephanie was a big proponent of bringing Jericho back. Hunter wasn't even sly about it, he was outright burying him to anyone who would listen, and people said he came off as very petty.

Did you feel that way at the time about Triple H?

Vince buys Penthouse from Donald

Vince McMahon just purchased a Penthouse in Donald Trump's new Trump Parc in Stamford, CT. The New York Daily News reports that he already owns the most expensive penthouse in the state, valued at $4 million.

Do you think he just liked the place or maybe was this part of a bigger deal?

Ratings for Raw Roulette

WWE Raw drew a 3.2 rating, one of its lower January ratings in years. Last year, the first two editions of Raw (Jan. 1 and 8) drew ratings of 3.9 and 3.7, much higher than last night’s rating. Two years ago, the first two Raws of the year drew ratings of 3.7 and 4.3. The first Raw of 2005 drew a 3.4. The previous three years the first Raw of the year drew ratings of 3.5, 3.6, 4.9, 4.6, 6.4, 5.7, and 3.3. You have to go back to 1997 to find a lower rating for Raw on the first Monday of the year, when it drew a 2.1 on Jan. 6, 1997. WK ANALYSIS: Raw did go up against the BCS college football game on Fox, so the ratings drop can’t be shouldered on Jeff Hardy vs. Umaga, the Raw Roulette Gimmick, or even the lack of follow–up on the Flair angle after it was the centerpiece of the previous week’s show.

The event

(Courtesy PW Torch)

WHAT HAPPENED: 1ST HOUR

–The show opened with a video package recapping the Ric Flair vs. Triple H match with Flair’s career at stake with William Regal interfering in the end.

–William Regal approached Vince McMahon backstage. He said he needed to talk to him. McMahon said, “Not now. “ He added that this is the first Raw of 2008 and WWE fans all over the world are expecting something great and innovative and he’s not going to let them down. He said he’s got “wrestlers “ (he means “sports entertainers, “ by the way, for those of you confused by such antiquated vernacular) who don’t know they’re wrestling or whom they’re wrestling. He unveiled the Raw Roulette wheel. He recited a few stips on the spinning wheel. He asked Regal, “Do you have any idea how big this is? “ Regal apologized for not hitting his son Hornswoggle last week. Regal said he thought he would redeem himself by taking Triple H out of the Royal Rumble match. That’s a nice explanation for his actions last week. McMahon said he had a good idea—Regal vs. Triple H in a match with the stip determined by the wheel. It came up First Blood. As Regal walked out of the office, Triple H jumped him and tossed him around backstage.

–The Raw opening aired. Chris Jericho has some prime real estate in the opening at two different times now, and Bobby Lashley is still included. Jim Ross and Jerry Lawler introduced the show.

–Shawn Michaels came out to a full ring intro followed by Mr. Kennedy. Just as they were about to wrestle, Vince interrupted on the big screen and said he would spin the wheel. It came up “Strange Bedfellows “ meaning Michaels and Kennedy had to team up against another team of unlikely partners.

1 –– SHAWN MICHAELS & MR. KENNEDY vs. TREVOR MURDOCH & CHARLIE HAAS The match was joined in progress. Michaels tagged himself in with a blind–tag and tossed Kennedy out of the ring. Haas reached under the ring and came back with a mask, saying, “Now it’s time! “ Michaels yanked him in the ring with the old–school top rope yank; haven’t seen that in a while. Michaels soon unmasked Haas, hit a top rope elbow on him, superkicked Murdoch off the ring apron, and then set up Sweet Chin Music. Kennedy distracted Michaels, leading to Haas getting up, but Michaels kicked him before any damage was done. Kennedy gave Michaels the Mic Check and made the cover to get the pin on Haas. Lawler said that was one of the strangest matches he’s ever seen. Ross called it a train wreck. Kennedy trash–talked Michaels up close right afterward.

WINNERS: Kennedy & Michaels in 6:00.

STAR RATING: *1/4

Kennedy and Michaels are involved in a pretty interesting feud here, especially since Kennedy picked up a win over Shawn. Do you think more could have been done with the two? Was Kennedy ready to be on that level?

2 –– CARLITO (w/Santino Marella) vs. HARDCORE HOLLY (w/Cody Rhodes) This was a “Trading Spaces “ match where Carlito had to dress as Hardcore Holly and Holly had to dress as Carlito. They came out to the other’s intro music, too. When Lawler said the blond hair looked good on Carlito, Ross said he’s not much of a hair guy. The Carlito wig didn’t last long on Holly. Cody gave Holly an apple which he spit in Carlito’s face, then he finished him with a spinning Alabama Slam for the win. Holly put the wig back on for a celebration.

WINNER: Holly in 3:00.

STAR RATING: 1/4*

How did Hardcore Holly like this? He seemed pretty nervous with that apple!

Did you like Cody/Hardcore Holly, as a team?

(We’re covering Hardcore Holly on Jan 28 on JR)

–Vince told Maria backstage she looked lovely. Vince said she could spin the wheel to determine the divas match. It came up “Submission. “ McMahon moved it back to “Lingerie Pillow Fight. “ They should have put Holly vs. Cody in that one. Vince told her she couldn’t put any foreign objects in the pillows. She said not to worry, her pillows are all natural. I think she meant “made in America. “ Vince didn’t say no unnatural objects. Anyway, it was just an excuse for McMahon to dazzle Maria on camera with his masculine machismo.

I guess it would have been too obvious that the wheel was gimmicked if Maria had spun it and it perfectly landed on the one female match option, right?

–A recap aired of the angle last week with the Hardys and Randy Orton. Todd Grisham then interviewed Jeff Hardy and asked how his brother is doing. He said not well. He said he spent New Year’s at the hospital with Matt. He said Matt has had his back at every turn in his entire life. He said he’s going to take his title and “take him out “ at that the Royal Rumble. I wish they finished that sentence. It always sounds like they’re going out for drinks or a ball game or something, not “take him out of action “ or “take him out of commission. “

–They showed Ross and Lawler on camera. Lawler said Hardy was booked against Umaga in a cage match later in the show.

–Backstage, Hornswoggle ran laps around the spinning wheel. Vince talked to Hornswoggle, but the audio quality was echoey and impossible to understand. It happens to the best of productions, doesn’t it? They cut away early and went to Ross plugging Regal vs. Hunter in a First Blood match. Lawler plugged that the divas match was next.

JR actually apologizes here for the issues. It seems like they didn’t have the audio turned on for viewers - but did have it on for the crowd and we could hear it through crowd mics.

–They went back to the Hornswoggle–Vince discussion. He told Hornswoggle he wasn’t going to let Regal hit him last week. He said if he wins his match tonight, he can be entered into the Royal Rumble. He said it will be a tag match, so he can choose anyone he wants to be his partner, and whichever pair wins the match will be entered into the Rumble.

3 –– MARIA vs. JILLIAN HALL vs. ASHLEY vs. MELINA vs. MICKEY JAMES—Lingerie Pillow Fight Ross said Lawler sounded like “a dirty camp counselor “ in the opening minutes of the match. Lawler said bouncing up and down on a bed is fun. Ross said he’s never done that. Lawler said he’d probably break it.

WINNER: Ashley in 4:00.

STAR RATING: n/a (horrible wrestling, but that was hardly the point).

This was Ashley’s return after her appearance on Survivor. Obviously, it was a happier time for her. Could Ashley have worked as an ambassador, an on-air personality, or in some other non-wrestling role?

–They showed Triple H heading toward the entrance tunnel.

–A commercial aired hyping that WWE was going to Hi–Def in two weeks on USA Network. That’s going to be cool.

–A plug for ECW hyped Chavo Guerrero vs. C.M. Punk.

–They went backstage to Super Crazy turning down the invite to team with Hornswoggle.

WHAT HAPPENED: 2ND HOUR

4 –– TRIPLE H vs. WILLIAM REGAL—First Blood Match

Ross told viewers not to count Regal out as he’s been fighting on the streets of England since he was 15. Regal came on strong, but Hunter knocked him to the floor qickly and got the better of him there. Regal slipped on brass knuckles, but Hunter threw Regal into the announce table before he could use them. Hunter threw steel steps at Regal, but Regal ducked them and knocked Hunter into the ringpost. Ross had such an intensity to his announcing early, it seemed like it’d be a short match as it couldn’t stay that intense for long. The crowd chanted “Regal sucks. “ Regal suplexed Hunter back in the ring at 2:00. Regal untied the top turnbuckle pad. Regal rammed Hunter face–first into the exposed buckle. Hunter checked for blood, but there wasn’t any. Regal hit a kneedrop. Hunter reversed Regal into the buckle and made a comeback. He went for a Pedigree, but Regal escaped and catapulted Triple H into a padded turnbuckle. The crowd again chanted “Regal sucks “ loudly. It’s the most sustained heel chant in a while on Raw. Regal put the knux on again. Hunter hit a spinebuster first, though, and pounded away at Regal’s forehead. Regal bled and the ref called for the bell. Hunter got in a few extra shots before dropping him. Then he celebrated and gave Regal a Pedigree.

WINNER: Triple H in 5:00.

STAR RATING: ** –– Good intensity and pacing throughout. They could have gone longer and not overstayed their welcome. Too bad WWE has never gotten behind pushing Regal as a serious heel contender as he could have pulled off good matches and really good promos.

How fun would a serious top-heel William Regal have been? Do you think he could have gotten strong heat on a champ like, say, Cena?

–Hornswoggle approached Santino backstage about being his partner. Santino said, “Why don’t we just get Count Chocula and call it a six–man? “ He said he’d have to be insane to team with him, so why not send him into the looney bin with Britney Spears. He said he doesn’t want to upset his papa and “no offense, but small people—how you say—creep me out! “ He got up and left.

–Ross and Lawler plugged the Royal Rumble’s JBL vs. Chris Jericho match. They went to extended clips of the feud dating back to Armageddon.

–Chris Jericho came out to his full ring intro. Vince spun the wheel as they cut to a break.

5 –– CHRIS JERICHO vs. SNITSKY & JBL

They announced that Jericho would have to face two men in a handicapped match. Snitsky came out first, then JBL. After initially fighting Snitsky, JBL charged in and knocked Jericho to the floor. Jericho got the best of it at first, ramming JBL into the announce table. JBL fired back with a shot with the bell, then he knocked the referee down. JBL shifted to choking Jericho with a cable. Ross said he seems to be overreacting to someone interrupting his announcing of a match. JBL dragged Jericho around ringside like a reluctant mule. The crowd booed. It dragged on longer than last week’s JBL ring introduction. Finally, just as JBL was going to hang him from a rafter, several referees came out along with Tony Garea and talked JBL into backing off briefly. Jericho gasped for breath and coughed as the crowd chanted “You suck “ at JBL.

WINNER: Jericho via DQ in 3:00.

STAR RATING: n/a

This wasn’t the best stuff. Jericho seemed stale here, 8-years after Y2K. What did you think of the match and the feud?

–They replayed clips of the JBL–Jericho brawl. Ross said JBL treated Jericho like an animal on his ranch. Who would treat an animal that way, and why? Lawler brought up a page from WWE.com listing wrestlers already qualified for the 30 man Rumble: Umaga, Holly, Snitsky, John Morrison, and The Miz. Ross said many of them have qualified at WWE live events.

6 –– THE HIGHLANDERS vs. HORNSWOGGLE & MICK FOLEY

At first Hornswoggle came out with B.K. Jordan. Hornswoggle didn’t look pleased that he had to settle for Jordan as his partner, a relatively skinny bald guy. Lawler said strings were hanging out of his sleeves, then added, “Oh, those are your arms. “ The guy’s arms looked like he worked out, but he was skinny overall. Anyway, Mick Foley came out and made the save for Hornswoggle, taking Jordan’s place. It’s sad that Foley “coming out of retirement “ occasionally has been reduced to this given what he once meant to the industry. At least it leads to Foley entering the Rumble, right? Hornswoggle did his usual duck and run moves, then hot–tagged in Foley at 2:00. Foley took control of the match against Rory and avoided interference from Robbie. Foley pulled out Mr. Socko and caught Rory in the mouth with it. Lawler gagged on commentary and said he threw up his lunch thinking about it. Foley tagged in Hornswoggle who hit a frog splash for the win. There was a day where Foley being entered into the Rumble and having a chance to headline WrestleMania again might have meant something to the buyrate.

WINNERS: Hornswoggle & Foley in 4:00.

STAR RATING: 1/2*

Shout out to Swoggle over at AdFreeShows.com. I really wish you guys would have had Swoggle pull out a little Mr. Socko. I think that would have been cute. Anyway.

–They showed the cage being lowered from the rafters down to the ring.

7 –– JEFF HARDY vs. UMAGA—Cage Match

After the ring intros for Hardy and Umaga, Randy Orton’s music played and he walked out onto the stage. Ross touted how emotional Jeff was over what happened to his brother, and how motivated he was to get revenge. Ross said Orton’s presence would change Hardy’s mindset in the match. Two minutes in Hardy attempted to escape the cage. Umaga yanked him to the mat as Orton shouted at him. They cut to a break. They showed Orton sitting at ringside intensely watching the match. They went to a clip of Umaga tossed Hardy around during the break. Ross called him a “Samoan SUV. “ Umaga applied a nerve hold. Lawler said it could paralyze Hardy’s arm and make it impossible for him to climb the cage and escape to win. Hardy attempted a comeback at 8:00, but Umaga backdropped a charging Hardy into the cage. Umaga scored a near fall in the ring, with Hardy stopping the count with his foot on the bottom rope. Orton tossed a chair into the ring, then another, and another. Umaga bashed Hardy across the back with a chair (not flush on the skull, thankfully). Umaga scored a near fall. Umaga atempted to climb the cage next, but Hardy knocked him off balance and Umaga crotched the top rope. Lawler said he just heard Umaga cry out in pain for the first time ever. Hardy leaped off of a chair and bashed Umaga with his legs. He then set up a Twist of Fate, but Umaga escaped and punched Hardy in the gut. Umaga set Hardy up in the corner and charged at him butt–first. Hardy set up a chair mid–ring and DDT’d Umaga into it. He went for a pin, but Umaga powered out. As Hardy was about to escape the cage, Orton slammed the cage door on his head. Ross said it was a no DQ match and there was nothing the referees could do about it. He said it has now gone beyond a wrestling match. Umaga draped an arm over Hardy. Ross declared, “Hardy will not die! Hardy will not die! What a match! What a night on Monday Night Raw! “ Great enthusiasm and inflection. Hardy surprised Umaga with a quick Twist of Fate at 14:00. He took off his shirt, got the squeals from the crowd, and climbed to the top of the cage. Orton was waiting for him on the floor. Umaga got up inside the ring. Hardy leaped off the top of of the cage with a Whisper in the Wind, or as Ross put it, “Good God almighty! For the love of God, a Whisper in the Wind from the top of the cage! Good Lord, I can’t believe what I’ve seen! “ Hardy scored the clean three count. Ross and Lawler sold how amazed and intimidated Orton seemed to be in reaction to what he just saw. Hardy climbed to the top of the cage and Ross said Hardy was “on top of the world. “ Nice imagery. They went to several replays of the big finish.

WINNER: Hardy in 15:00.

STAR RATING: **** –– A really strong cage match with a memorable classic finish to a Raw main event, made perhaps twice as memorable by Ross’s call of the match.

As usual, JR calling a match is like adding JR’s BBQ Sauce to delicious meat...it’s already tasty but you just make it even better. What did you think about the match?

How nice was it to see these two in a main event, instead of the ‘usual suspects,’ so to speak?

KELLER’S FINAL THOUGHTS

A good show, but there was some stuff that wasn’t so good. JBL dragging Chris Jericho around by his neck was dragged out longer than JBL’s ring entrance on Raw last week. Trying to hang Jericho was taking things a bit too far. There just isn’t the backstory to this feud to make such an attempted lynching feel realistic. It felt cartoonishly overdone. There is rarely a time for attempted murder or hangings in pro wrestling angles, and this feud is far from it. The Roulette Wheel felt anything but spontaneous. Were wigs on hand for everyone in case that came up? Or all gimmick matches they could have chosen to feature on this night, who thought fans needed to see Holly and Carlito dressed up as each other. There are better silly comedy ideas than that. Mick Foley has been marginalized by how he’s been booked. It was a big deal when he retired. It’s hardly noteworthy when he frequently comes out of retirement. He’s treated as someone with the resume of Bastion Booger, not a serious top five contributor to the biggest boom period in WWE history.

What did you think about WWE Raw Roulette?