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V7EP11 (Patreon)

Published:
2021-07-17 19:32:23
Imported:
2021-07

Content

Extended Thoughts:
Ironwood V. Watts.  Watching this fight scene was super super intense. There's a wind when Ironwood says I will Sacrifice whatever, whatever it takes to stop her.  The immediate thought I have watching that scene back is even your humanity bro?  This  is a classic case of the road to hell is paved with good intentions. It's funny because I yo-yoed between liking Ironwood in distrusting Ironwood. In his attempt to live up to his job which is to protect the citizens of mantle and Atlas he's losing his Humanity and we coming strictly Machiavellian.

Also, another scene that deserves some more room in our Collective imaginations is the scene where Salem makes her presence known. Ruby stands up to her as the top-tier protagonist that  she is. while like the top-tier antagonist that Salem is she completely crushes Ruby's resolved and leaves her crying in the fetal position basically. It really sets the stage for how many sing Salem is and how she is the big villain.

Files

RWBY Chapter 7 Episode 11

Watch "RWBY Chapter 7 Episode 11" on Streamable.

Comments

Allie Funk

That fight between Watts and Ironwood is one of my favorites of the entire series. I really wish we got to see Watts fight more as he's got such a unique combat style. Ironwood is such an interesting character to me. Characters like Salem, Tyrian, etc. know they're the bad guys, but a character like Ironwood will always see themself as the good guy no matter what. Ironwood has the intentions of a hero, but his paranoia is going to push himself the other way if he isn't careful. How do reason with someone who refuses to see that they're not doing the right thing?

Anonymous

To answer your question about Ironwood: yes, he is willing to sacrifice his humanity. He is, after all, the Tin Man. He is a cyborg, and the more robotic he becomes physically, the more emotionless and focused he becomes, as well. Qrow said this about Ironwood in Volume 3: "sometimes, I wonder if he even has a heart." Remember his semblance being Mettle? The will to strengthen his resolve and do what must be done no matter what? This is becoming more clear as the episodes progress, and it's not stopping anytime soon. He really is a human version of the Tin Man, and I personally find it both terrifying and sad.

Anonymous
>>63961751

Its because fear has blinded him from doing what is truly right. He overcame his fear after seeing grimm invading mantle and seeing he need to work with everyone. Despite being told that Salem cannot be killed and even fought watts he did all of that, but after seeing somebody (Cinder and Neo) was still able to get inside, after questioning rather or not this was all their plan (actually it wasnt), and after seeing salem and seeing that she was on her way, fear overcame him and he wanted to get far away as soon as possible. He sees himself as a hero, but he is letting fear dictate his actions instead of logic, reason and truth. He has the right to be mad about being lied to initially, but can you blame rwby and co when they didnt know who to trust? And now that they trusted him with the truth, its backfiring on them.

Anonymous

I honestly side with Ironwood here. Now I know mantle has a lot of people that need saving I get that, but in the face of an immortal goddess trying to destroy all life on remnant I think the answer is to get the relics as far from her as possible, or at least delay the inevitable. Idk I just feel like Mantle isn’t really the biggest priority in this situation. I guess I just have the “Antagonist mindset” lol

Anonymous

And here we have it the true appearance of Ironwoods semblance, Mettle. Its another passive one like Clovers or Qrows, but Mettle is a true Hell or high water semblance. When he sets his mind to something it WILL be done and the harder that's pushed back against the harder he'll push back. Looking back you can see it in a lot of his previous scenes usually in the form of distrust or a show of stubborn force. It's what made him take lead of the tournament from Oz in vol3 its what made him question Oz's slow and steady plan in vol2, his shakedown of Jacques in vol4, pulling the skin off of his own arm, and now this. It can be easy to paint him as a villian here when hes making calls like this, but when in all actuality hes an anti-hero. He believes what he's doing is whats right, he knows its not what's best for everyone, he hates that this is the decision that he has to make, but his oath is to stop Salem first the people are second and he can no longer wait. In his eyes this is what will save the world and as many people of his kingdom as possible.

Anonymous

My momma always told me "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions. " As a child it irritated me because my good intentions were childish. To do artwork and make friends. As an adult, I realized you'd be hard pressed to find a Dictator who didn't start out with good intentions. Save people, keep them safe from the bad guys, make a fair society. They all end the same though. Mass death. It's not enough to believe you are on the side of good or to do the right thing. And the ends rarely justify the means. Right and moral aren't the same thing. I had a friend who was a legalist. She constantly threw us under the bus because her ancient belief system told her to follow the orders of the book. She caused so much harm following orders... to this day she remains friendless. She did the right thing according to the letter of the law, but she caused misery everywhere she went.

Anonymous

Salem really don't show up until the end of the volume but just steals it. She's so damn casual and motherly in her threats that its freaky.

Anonymous

I was excited to see your reaction when Salem mentions Ruby's mom! That part always gives me chills. When I first saw this, it made me think of what really happened to Summer. If you go back and listen to Red Like Roses Part 2, there are these lyrics: "I didn't have a choice, I did what I had to do I made a sacrifice, but forced a bigger sacrifice on you" and also "But, baby, please don't do what I did I don't want you to waste your life in vain" It makes me wonder if Summer played a bigger role in all of this... Also, Salem was already aware about Ruby and her silver eyes back in Vol 4. But the moment she actually saw her in this episode, she KNEW she was Summer's daughter. CHILLS, MANNNN!!! (I don't remember if Salem has already seen Ruby before this points in previous volumes. I could be wrong and might've missed it. It's been a hot minute lol)

Anonymous

And to answer your question regarding what Watts was referring to at the beginning of the fight: Back in the episode when Pietro was talking about how he created Penny, he was holding a photo of him and his other colleagues. And his thumb was covering one person's face which was Watts, so he used to work with Pietro and the other scientists before he faked his death. He was angry because Ironwood chose Pietro's project over his

Anonymous

I’m glad you noticed when Ironwood’s turning point was, because I’ll always view it as “I will sacrifice whatever it takes to stop her.” Team RWBY is willing to take this chance, but Ironwood thinks he can get Atlas to safety. Team RWBY also knows that Salem will find a way to Atlas even if it’s aaaallll the way up there. She has all the time in the world to find solutions to her problems. It’s also something worth noting going forward that Ironwood is basically willing to screw over the rest of the world and save the most rich and racist elites. That never settled well with me.

Anonymous
>>63963747

I always viewed his semblance as just speeding along the decisions he would have made regardless and further hardening his resolve. His semblance isn’t the reason he’s willing to sacrifice so much, HE is. Mettle just makes that spiral faster and harder than it perhaps would if the semblance weren’t there

Zen Reacts

I may not fully agree with Ironwoods methods but I could never support the full idealism of team RWBY here

Cmdrwilkens

In regards to the V7 opening being hard to beat...oh boy. When you get to V8 I think you're gonna have one hell of a time. My personal ranking is 8,6,7,2 but its gonna be a LOT closer than you think (and its only a short while away). That said I think, if it works with your schedule, a full V7 album review would be awesome because the OST is probably the most full of bangers out of all 7 that are released and I don't think we've tapped you for any of the individual songs yet.

Cage Nightwind

I feel like they rushed the turning of Ironwood a little but at the same time, paranoia and PTSD will do that to ya. As for my thoughts on this episode/arc? I think Team RWBY and Ironwood are both in the wrong. They're both so set on their own ways being right that they're not willing to listen to each other and find a middle ground. Ironwood sees them as idealistic kids who lied to him. Team RWBY sees him as a dictator who needs to be stopped. They've stopped treating each other as people... And while it's never touched on at all, you could say that that is also part of Salem's game.

Anonymous

And this episode here is the breaking point. Here starts the eternal opposition between Ironwood and RWBY, and I can tell you I've seen so many people siding with either side and debating for hours and getting to no result. It's the idealism of Team RWBY, the idea of wanting to save the people you can directly save first, because these are human lives, because these matter, while Ironwood has an utilitarian mindset and focuses on the consequences as a whole, and think that sacrificing these people is fine if it stops Salem from getting all the Relics (and thus protect more people in Remnant). And despite the fact he's losing his humanity in the process, he's not completely wrong - when you're fighting a war, you want to move towards that final goal as fast as possible, otherwise you'll keep losing more men and making more sacrifices that could be avoided. What do you do when your only choices are trading deaths with more deaths ? At this point, RWBY and Ironwood are simply on both extremes of the same issue and none of them is willing to take a step in the other's direction, dooming both to fail.

David J Moore

Also, big ups to Caleb Hyles as the guest vocalist for "Hero" this episode!

David J Moore
>>63979744

Also, keep in mind that "she can't be killed" doesn't mean "she can't be stopped." If "she can't be stopped," that implies that her victory is inevitable, that there's no point in fighting her, and everyone should just give up.

Spadeas

Oops my French origins have slipped into the comment of the day, my bad. The "pour" in the first sentence, stand for a "for", it's more clear now ^^. Back to the episode. I love the fight between Arthut and James, it's the first real gunfight of the show. Both have guns, not a weapon who is also a gun, just gun. Speaking about Ironwood "heroism", he even does a super hero landing in the previous episode. I would like to applaud Tyrian too for being able to stand up in a 1V3 fight against 3 elite huntsmens. Tyrian who can't help but smile when he hears the news about Ironwood and the RWBY team ... A chaos expert loves when this one approaches. Finally, the scene between Ruby and Salem, it always gives me a pinch in the heart. Ruby has never ceased to be strong to keep the group on the surface and lead them to where they are, without her in volume 5 they would have died because of Apathy... She even faces Salem and somehow threatens her, but Salem just presses on an unhealed wound ... and Ruby breaks down in tears. This is only the fifth(?) time that we see Ruby so affected. It was the case for the death of Penny, of Pyrrha, when she writes her letter in volume 4 and when Yang and Weiss find it in volume 5. But this time it is even more powerful and it is still strong that the character who inspires others, cracks like that. But it's to "burn" better in the next episode ;-). The next two are also action packed, so stand ready.

RadShiro

The thing that was always interesting about this episode was I COULD see where Ironwood was coming from, but I just cannot agree with him. We already know Salem is immortal and powerful, what is running away going to accomplish? You're gonna leave HALF OF YOUR KINGDOM to die just because you're scared? Not that he would ever admit to being scared. Run away with two relics sure, but for how long? She could have a hoard of grimm capable of reaching you in A DAY. If he had a solid plan AFTER running away maybe I could believe him more, but all I see is a paranoid cowardly general trying to run away to save himself the so called" Hero". He's the "Hero" and only he can do whats right, while he conveniently ignores EVERYONE around him becuz "they cant see the big picture". Thats his biggest failure as a general and person, he doesn't listen to other people. It's ALWAYS been his way or the highway. He doesn't actually sacrifice anything while saying he does. Hes not hurting himself, hes hurting others for his goals. And thats what makes me hate Ironwood in this volume. Even before this episode I really disliked him, this episode made me hate him. On the flip side I can see RWBY was being very idealistic but even then I would probably side with them. We know Salem is powerful and we can't stop her at this time, so lets just try and save as many people as we can. I would've been fighting right alongside them. SAVE YOUR ALLIES, DONT LEAVE THEM TO DIE

Anonymous

damn. "I would disrespect him before he dies" "DROP HIM" "his head needs to be on the other side of the street" david woke up today and chose violence

Anonymous

also this is one of my fav episodes, the ironwood/watts fight is a banger, the tyrion fight is great, Salem's appearance is INCREDIBLE, and then the very end, when ironwood and ruby stare each other down and those strings go is one of my favorite musical cue moments in the show, it's just so dramatic and poised and MAN so good (the song that plays with those strings and throughout salem's cameo is called "Are You With Me?" and it's gorg)

Deanie

Sometimes it feels like the biggest parts of this episode get overshadowed by the fight and the amazing song by Caleb. But it truly amazes me that in the final scenes, everything is breaking apart in his plan, and yet ironwood still chooses to more than third his personal attack force. Martial law and on top of that he’s imprisoning the people who are disagreeing with him, leaving most of his kingdom to die in this worlds most horrible way without trying to think of another, more humane way. Watts made a comment during the fight, “unless you really want to turn more of that body of yours into metal” and the most amazing part of this is that the fact his body is more damaged and supposedly going to become more robotic, his methodology and morals have too. It was both clever foreshadowing and symbolism and it really makes you realise that ironwood is going the wrong direction. He’s lost both trust and love in this episode. (Remember the intro, “trust in love and open up your eyes” he no longer has either so will never be able to see the big picture)