A Conversation With Wichannoi and Dieselnoi: Ultimate Legends | Bonus (Patreon)
Content
Bonus material, be sure to turn on English subtitles: This is something new and really cool that we're able to do through your support, using resources from patrons for documentary projects like this. Honestly, there is nothing like this anywhere on the internet. We went to see Wichannoi at his beverage distribution company in Bangkok, chaperoned by Dieselnoi himself. For some background, Wichannoi is one of the greatest fighters of all time. He's from the Silver Age of Muay Thai, but fought into the early Golden Age and when we ask the best fighters from the Golden Age to name their "Top 5, All-Time Greatest Yodmuay," Wichannoi tops that list, over and over again. (Dieselnoi is consistently in the top 3 as well.) He's the hero's hero. And he fought Dieselnoi three times, winning the first two fights. Dieselnoi adores him. Before I ever met Wichannoi, I asked Dieselnoi who he thought was the best and he didn't hesitate at all to say Wichannoi. He also has advised me and taught me according to Wichannoi's style on numerous occasions; I think Dieselnoi learned a great deal from fighting him.
Go to the full conversation on YouTube here, be sure to turn on English subtitles
We actually went to meet Wichannoi in order to film with him for the Muay Thai Library, to preserve his techniques and get his persona and character on film. As it turned out, something was lost in the communication between him and Dieselnoi, setting up the session, and Wichannoi wasn't into that, so we just let the camera role. This isn't a formal interview. We actually expected that we were at some point to go and do a Library session, but what came out of it was unique and awesome in its own right. Wichannoi had fought for a long time, active for somewhere around two decades and was competitive against much bigger and much younger fighters far into his career. But he's also 71 years old in this video and many, many decades removed from training or teaching Muay Thai. So, the Library entry kind of went sideways, but we ended up getting a great deal of discussion of his technique, how he trained, how he strategized and thought about fighting, as well as his personality as he was talking with me and Dieselnoi. It's wonderful, really. It's also incredible to see the interaction between Dieselnoi and Wichannoi, talking about their fights together and some about contemporary scoring and judging. It's a glimpse into how the greatest fighters from the greatest era think about Muay Thai, both back in their day and now. And you get to see them talking about it, rather than just have someone tell you what they said.
Some of the things talked about are: a fight that Dieselnoi and Wichannoi had recently watched on TV and completely disagreed with the decision. They talk about what's changed in scoring, as well as corruption in refereeing. Dieselnoi alludes to how the success of Muay Thai on a global level has actually brought about regulations in Thailand that come from outside of the Muay Thai community and might, indeed, be detrimental to the future of Thailand's Muay Thai. They talk about Wichannoi's strategies for handling all different styles of Muay, as well as how one should train in order to prepare for any opponent. Dieselnoi and Wichannoi talk about each other as fighters, as well as bringing up points about each other as opponents when they fought each other. I ask about Muay Thai fighters who became Western Boxers with success and they talk about this a little bit, as well as a few comments on the contemporary International Superstars, Buakaw and Saenchai.
There's a lot to be pulled out of this discussion and maybe it's something I can write about. It's a natural conversation in the video, so there are references and broader discussions that can be brought out of it, but even just seeing these two legends go back and forth is pretty incredible to me. If Ali and Frazer were having a chat, you'd pull your jaw up off of the table and listen. That's what this felt like for me, even though I got lost a few times due to language barriers. I love how Dieselnoi keeps trying to get me to ask Wichannoi questions that I've asked Dieselnoi, totally like my dad saying, "go ahead and ask your great uncle, ask him about the service." It's very sweet, and Dieselnoi admits that he's learned a great deal from Wichannoi, like a mentor... who he also fought.
Watch
Go to the full conversation on YouTube here, be sure to turn on English subtitles
Understanding Why Wichannoi Was So Great
To really get the best picture of the kind of fighter Wichannoi was, and again many legends of the sport consider him the greatest (see that them say that here), I strongly recommend you read Ryan Wagner's film study article on him at the Fight Site:
go to Vicharnnoi Porntawee: Legacy of the Immortal Boxer
He does an incredible job of bringing to life his beautiful fighting strategy, his use of stinging low kick attacks from the outside, and his explosive combinations, using GIFs and short video clips. You will understand even better what Dieselnoi describes in the conversation, enriching it. This is worth the study.
The Greatest of the Greats
you can see a high res, zoomable version of this photo here
The entire 123 Greatest book is put on the Patreon supported Roundtable Forum, you can go to Wichannoi's entry here. And browse other legends of his era, and others. Each entry has an English language portion. Wichannoi's entry looks like this:
One of the things we are doing in these efforts is to make sure the excellence of the past does not fad from memory. We do have English language curators highlighting fighters whose video have survived, but our knowledge is passing through a very small keyhole. It is for this reason that I started asking legends themselves who THEY thought were the best of the best, just so we could hear from the men who shared the ring with greatness saw first hand. Please check out the growing playlist of legends picking their top five:
What surprise many English language fans, including myself, was how many times Wichannoi was at the top of many of these lists. Watch the 5 Greatest Playlist here.
You can also watch Dieselnoi''s list here.
This is all part of a new dimension of the Preserve The Legacy project. This conversation between Dieselnoi and Wichannoi is made public, because this is serious history, and everyone should be able to watch it. But translation projects like this are difficult and can be expensive. In particular, Dieselnoi's Thai can be hard to translate - in fact the subtitles in the conversation are open to community improvement, so if you know Thai and feel like you can improve them in part please do! (or, if you are fluent in both Thai and another language, please consider submitting another language translation too!).
We now are working to translate much more material, so Thais can speak more for themselves. This is all possible through your support.
This session is a bonus, the regular next Muay Thai entry in the Library, probably with Kru Manop, should be up in a week!
Be sure to watch the Dieselnoi sessions in the Library:
#48 Dieselnoi Chor. Thanasukarn - Jam Session (80 min) watch it here
#30 Dieselnoi Chor Thanasukarn 2 - Muay Khao Craft (42 min) watch it here
#3 Dieselnoi Chor Thanasukarn - The King of Knees (54 min) - watch it here
#76 Dieselnoi Chor Thanasukarn 4 - How to Fight Tall (69 min) watch it here
Chatchai Sasakul was also discussed in this conversation:
#64 Chatchai Sasakul - Elements of Boxing (72 min) watch it here
#14 Chatchai Sasakul - Perfecting Hands (106 min) watch it here
Bonus Session 5: Chatchai Sasakul Southpaw Hands | 52 min - watch it here
Browse the entire Library here
Some Have Asked for the Transcript of Past Translation Work
Go to the full conversation on YouTube here, be sure to turn on English subtitles
Here is just the raw text file of the English translation, if anyone wants to skim through it. The translation is still under revision and improvement so may not reflect this exact text:
0:04:41.970,0:04:46.168
[talking about a fight seen recently on TV] the odds were "38 40" then grabbed and threw him once and won
0:04:46.502,0:04:48.580
How did they come to that decision?
Was it right?
0:04:48.873,0:04:51.036
It was not loss due to skill.
It was loss due to energy.
0:04:52.482,0:04:54.796
- Not good
- Not good
0:04:56.642,0:05:00.905
I watched it and it was wrong.
0:05:02.861,0:05:04.674
I got it wrong too. [had it for the other guy]
0:05:05.296,0:05:09.267
He landed kicks and knees, but then fell and was done.
0:05:09.300,0:05:16.765
That blue side kicked, but then fell one time and lost. I don't understand.
0:05:17.786,0:05:19.548
Referee judged that way.
0:05:20.130,0:05:22.744
- They judged it a loss.
- Yes
0:05:22.968,0:05:25.463
Nothing can be done. Do you know why?
0:05:25.842,0:05:29.128
Look at the new generation. If you argue
with them, they will mess with you.
0:05:29.224,0:05:30.478
I want to hit them with a table.
0:05:30.948,0:05:32.370
You can't even say a word.
0:05:33.404,0:05:37.035
You just fought. Did you cheat?
0:05:37.430,0:05:42.702
Last week, Faasatan from Kru Toy.
0:05:43.037,0:05:47.147
Finished fight at 3:1 But didn't win.
Lost for sure. Lost by far.
0:05:47.490,0:05:50.223
Judges gave it to blue.
The audience started shouting
0:05:50.673,0:05:56.849
I asked him [red?], "What happened?" The fighter said
his opponent didn't do anything in 4 rounds.
0:05:57.329,0:05:59.860
And he didn't win it in Round 5.
0:06:00.272,0:06:03.719
Reports came out about this fight.
0:06:03.793,0:06:06.541
The report said the odds were 2:1
0:06:06.618,0:06:09.322
I wanted to ask the judges "are you
sure you actually watched the match?"
0:06:11.625,0:06:13.389
I don't understand why
it turned out like this.
0:06:13.627,0:06:18.813
If, for example, in round 5 you throw the opponent
down once or twice, and you win just for that
0:06:18.972,0:06:20.904
Then what comes next, right?
0:06:21.128,0:06:23.148
How could Muay Thai and a fighter grow?
0:06:24.638,0:06:27.882
It is not enjoyable to watch, it's difficult.
0:06:28.372,0:06:29.488
But what can you do?
0:06:29.668,0:06:31.172
Nowadays things have changed.
0:06:31.750,0:06:39.250
Ask Pi Cheep [Wichannoi] about Muay Thai in the past.
How were the gloves? Small?
0:06:39.606,0:06:41.860
- In the past. Small.
- Small?
0:06:42.296,0:06:43.653
They were small in the past, weren't they?
0:06:43.925,0:06:46.065
Nobody cared.
0:06:46.339,0:06:50.685
But nowadays, did you notice why
authorities pay attention to Muay Thai?
0:06:50.926,0:06:53.581
Don't forget that Muay Thai
has been accepted worldwide.
0:06:53.589,0:06:54.845
Money has been coming in.
0:06:55.154,0:06:59.993
Officials got involved.
They have no idea about Muay Thai.
0:07:01.028,0:07:02.768
They start to set rules, for example
forbidding children to fight.
0:07:03.702,0:07:05.414
These people want to do good things.
0:07:05.874,0:07:08.236
Yes want to do good things but you
have to look at their backgrounds.
0:07:08.236,0:07:10.024
- yes, consider their backgrounds.
- right?
0:07:10.214,0:07:12.684
What is the state of things now?
0:07:12.965,0:07:15.945
Westerners have good bodies, right?
0:07:16.187,0:07:17.946
But they start fighting
when they are adults.
0:07:17.971,0:07:19.635
If we don't fight from a young age, we will lose Muay Thai.
0:07:20.087,0:07:22.751
- We won't be able to compete. Am I right?
- Right.
0:07:22.943,0:07:26.418
How about banning children from fighting?
What would you expect?
0:07:27.155,0:07:31.469
When another country invites a Thai to fight
in their country, they pay for everything.
0:07:31.469,0:07:33.472
They [Thais] like it, you see?
0:07:33.957,0:07:35.947
They benefit from this kind of event.
0:07:35.947,0:07:39.940
Small things.
There are some issues. [I believe Dieselnoi is saying that Thais will take disadvantages to travel for fights...]
0:07:40.400,0:07:47.079
When in the clinch, you can kick the leg like this. At close range.
0:07:47.079,0:07:49.710
Here here. Listen. I told her about this.
0:07:49.895,0:07:52.834
I told her...
0:07:53.144,0:07:55.493
For Muay Khao,
the moment that the opponent is close...
0:07:55.493,0:08:00.423
You know what Pi Cheep
did, he kicked [low] like this.
0:08:00.423,0:08:02.548
Does it hurt? Yes it does.
0:08:02.946,0:08:05.527
Yes it hurts. But here...
0:08:05.527,0:08:07.927
Pi Cheep would...
When Pi Cheep fought, he would...
0:08:10.038,0:08:11.420
Right there, very fast.
0:08:11.420,0:08:16.681
When I watch tape of Wichannoi now.
You kicked legs a lot, right?
0:08:19.490,0:08:23.795
When your opponent is left handed,
kick here, right?
0:08:24.311,0:08:28.012
Sirimongkol was like that [left handed].
0:08:28.012,0:08:31.297
What about your fight with Khunpon?
0:08:33.742,0:08:40.962
- She asked how to fight against Muay Khao, and tall opponents?
- Yes
0:08:44.463,0:08:45.889
I told her the technique.
0:08:45.889,0:08:53.785
You fought for a long time,
you changed your technique. right?
0:08:53.785,0:08:57.694
I told her techniques would change.
0:08:58.920,0:09:02.600
Yes techniques have to
change, as to the situation.
0:09:03.570,0:09:07.041
For example,
if you fight against Muay Khao.
0:09:07.041,0:09:13.206
Or Femeu, kickers, punches, etc.
You have to adapt.
0:09:13.206,0:09:18.607
So we have to adjust our timing.
0:09:18.607,0:09:22.681
Take for example knee fighting.
How do we handle it?
0:09:22.681,0:09:24.419
If it's a Muay Khao opponent,
we have to clinch a lot.
0:09:24.419,0:09:30.232
You have to have a strong body to take strikes and
move in and out. That's vs Muay Khao.
0:09:30.232,0:09:35.731
For punchers,
you need a high and strong guard.
0:09:35.731,0:09:38.867
For kickers,
you need to guard, teep, etc.
0:09:39.280,0:09:43.580
- These are the steps.
- What did you like the best?
0:09:43.580,0:09:50.020
- Do I like what?
- You mean what technique he likes?
0:09:50.700,0:09:55.400
-For himself, his own preference. Did you like to punch, femeu, what did you like best?
0:10:00.180,0:10:01.820
You mean for Pi Cheep?
0:10:02.627,0:10:03.818
He could use many techniques.
0:10:03.818,0:10:10.206
He explained in his day, if his opponent was a puncher, he would punch also.
0:10:10.206,0:10:14.577
Then if people prefer kicking, he would kick also.
0:10:15.579,0:10:18.287
But what did he do the best? Punching in combinations
0:10:18.288,0:10:19.405
Combination punches.
0:10:20.451,0:10:22.555
You could depend on this, right?
0:10:22.555,0:10:26.083
His best technique was punching in sets.
0:10:26.083,0:10:30.328
When he fought, how could he have such a long career?
0:10:30.328,0:10:35.934
He studied the opponent, read the crowd
and saw what techniques fans liked.
0:10:35.934,0:10:43.616
In Thailand, kicking the leg doesn't really score, right? It's more to disturb the opponent's composure?
0:10:44.537,0:10:51.561
Points can given overall for
a fighter's style and techniques. So yes, composure [ruup][ is part of it].
0:10:51.561,0:10:57.240
For example, we kick the
opponent's leg to stop his weapons.
0:10:57.240,0:11:02.198
The opponent is good at kicking. But you
stop him. And he can't kick you.
0:11:02.198,0:11:07.339
We interrupt his timing and rhythm.
Judges can see who is controlling whom.
0:11:07.707,0:11:12.676
If the opponent can't use his weapons,
judges will see this.
0:11:12.676,0:11:17.967
For Muay Khao, you have to be
close, clinch and grab the neck.
0:11:18.189,0:11:22.110
If you can't grab the neck,
but he grabs your neck...
0:11:22.110,0:11:26.485
you have to control the arms, reach one hand between his arms
to push the opponent's jaw.
0:11:26.485,0:11:30.643
And use the other hand around the outside.
When he tries to knee, you time him and you push him back.
0:11:30.643,0:11:31.989
He will bounch off.
0:11:33.039,0:11:37.621
This is the right way to handle
the opponent's technique.
0:11:37.991,0:11:41.382
For knee fighters, before he reaches you,
0:11:42.419,0:11:48.507
he will have to take your weapons as he tries to come in,
like teeps, kicks, punches.
0:11:49.270,0:11:52.240
If he reaches you but still can't hit
you, what's going to happen?
0:11:52.240,0:11:55.077
If he is hit on his way in, but when he reaches
you he still can't knee... it's over, [he can't score].
0:11:57.450,0:12:02.233
These are general guidelines.
0:12:02.233,0:12:09.148
For Muay Deen [kickers],
we have to have good eyes to see their movement and be quick.
0:12:09.148,0:12:12.531
Step back, block,
teep to cut off their weapons
0:12:12.531,0:12:16.040
and time our counters to fight back.
0:12:16.040,0:12:19.695
It will turn the fight to
our advantage to handle a kicker like this.
0:12:19.695,0:12:26.595
When we are going to fight,
it's not only what you have, what you're good at.
0:12:26.595,0:12:29.928
We have to study the opponent
and prepare for how to defend and handle their skills.
0:12:30.251,0:12:35.359
In training, focus on how to deal
with his weapons and style.
0:12:35.359,0:12:40.454
How to defend. How to strike.
This is key.
0:12:42.095,0:12:48.673
If both fighters have strong hands,
like when you fought Sirimonkol, he had lots of KOs.
0:12:48.673,0:12:52.706
If both have heavy hands, you switch to
leg kicks and teeps?
0:12:53.446,0:12:54.893
You handle each style accordingly.
0:12:54.893,0:12:58.185
Pi Cheep would observe the
opponent's styles and techniques.
0:12:58.185,0:13:00.927
To fight with Muay Khao, he would
0:13:00.952,0:13:03.389
see how the opponent knees.
And then plan how to defend.
0:13:04.107,0:13:07.299
So it depends on the opponent.
0:13:07.299,0:13:11.497
It's not just to go out
there and fight. No.
0:13:11.497,0:13:14.523
Whom will you fight with? What's his style?
Is he right handed? How does he fight?
0:13:14.523,0:13:15.958
He likes to use punches.
Look at how he punches.
0:13:21.064,0:13:26.236
When I fought with Pi Cheep,
I took a lot of teeps.
0:13:26.236,0:13:28.416
It was like fighting and
teaching at the same time.
0:13:30.341,0:13:32.727
This kind of fighter doesn't exist today.
0:13:32.727,0:13:38.133
I think. Like last time I fought with Wichannoi.
0:13:38.133,0:13:39.930
I kept advancing. I lost.
0:13:39.930,0:13:41.853
He used a lot of kicks and teeps.
0:13:41.853,0:13:46.116
He was older already. He was slow.
0:13:46.116,0:13:53.069
Then I punched him and he slumped.
0:13:53.069,0:13:57.400
You know why? He was so clever.
He was provoking me to keep coming.
0:13:57.400,0:14:04.037
He tricked me to move in closer.
When I moved in, I got hit and was done.
0:14:07.873,0:14:10.608
The older generation had good strategy.
0:14:11.007,0:14:15.203
Focus. He was very good at
focus and concentration.
0:14:15.203,0:14:20.600
Pi Cheep, do you remember our
first fight at Rajadamnern? It was very entertaining.
0:14:20.600,0:14:23.802
Very entertaining. It was very entertaining every
time I fought with Pi Cheep.
0:14:23.802,0:14:26.723
In Round 5, Pi Cheep just stayed there.
0:14:26.723,0:14:29.467
I didn't move in, either. I just held my ground.
0:14:29.467,0:14:31.936
Then I just looked at him
and wondered what he would do.
0:14:31.936,0:14:35.292
Suddenly he rushed in and attacked me.
0:14:35.292,0:14:38.376
Do you know what I got from that day?
0:14:38.376,0:14:44.275
First, focus only on the present when in the ring.
I have to make my own decisions.
0:14:44.402,0:14:46.739
Second, how to handle unexpected events.
0:14:48.128,0:14:52.085
Experience. I didn't understand
the word "experience".
0:14:52.085,0:14:55.303
I thought it means the number of
years in fighting. But I didn't know.
0:14:55.303,0:14:57.201
I knew right away that day.
0:14:58.195,0:15:01.042
I knew right away this is "experience".
And concentration.
0:15:01.798,0:15:05.354
Another thing is mentality.
0:15:05.810,0:15:11.892
Pi Cheep, when you fought, did you
care about anyone outside the ring?
0:15:12.628,0:15:16.085
Ask him.
0:15:16.085,0:15:17.465
Do you understand?
0:15:18.022,0:15:23.698
I asked "Pi Cheep, when you got into the ring, did you think about other people?"
0:15:23.698,0:15:26.964
He said no. Only your opponent.
0:15:27.755,0:15:29.634
You listen to the trainer only
when you go back to the corner.
0:15:29.634,0:15:30.634
Go ahead, ask him.
0:15:32.355,0:15:34.916
I asked him for you.
0:15:34.916,0:15:37.438
In the ring,
he didn't think about other people.
0:15:37.438,0:15:41.620
Focus only on the opponent. What is the
opponent going to do? How can I defend?
0:15:42.639,0:15:43.608
You don't have to listen to anybody else.
0:15:43.608,0:15:46.820
Don't pay attention. Only listen to the
trainer when you go back to the corner. [During the rounds it's all up to you]
0:15:47.140,0:15:48.620
That's him.
0:15:49.775,0:15:56.489
Back in the day, there weren't highlights or tape of opponents.
You had to go to see them fight, right?
0:15:56.489,0:16:01.774
You listen to the cornerman and
make your own adjustments, right?
0:16:01.774,0:16:06.899
When you went to watch fights, what kind of fighter did you like?
0:16:06.899,0:16:09.834
- What kind of fighter do you like?
- What kind of fighter do I like?
0:16:09.834,0:16:11.633
- you
- me?
0:16:11.633,0:16:14.285
I like an all-round style.
0:16:14.285,0:16:16.087
Femeu is fun to watch?
0:16:16.087,0:16:18.037
General style, defend here and there.
0:16:18.299,0:16:22.814
Move in, defend, make adjustments and change up.
0:16:22.814,0:16:27.338
Who had the best skills back in the days?
0:16:27.338,0:16:29.828
Many people.
0:16:29.828,0:16:32.287
Sylvie, he doesn't know how to answer this question.
0:16:32.287,0:16:35.315
Because westerners don't know.
0:16:35.315,0:16:38.712
They only know Buakaw, Saenchai.
They don't know.
0:16:38.712,0:16:42.048
Now they know Samart, but he...
0:16:42.048,0:16:47.185
They don't know the fighters from before. Westerners think Buakaw is Yodmuay.
0:16:48.286,0:16:50.535
Really. They don't know older fighters.
0:16:50.535,0:16:57.700
In the past, no TV. People had to go to
see the fights or read the newspaper.
0:16:57.700,0:17:02.773
But when you went to see fights live, you thought everyone was entertaining, or?
0:17:02.773,0:17:08.856
Was there anyone you watched and then when you went back to training at the gym you took ideas from them?
0:17:11.864,0:17:14.976
Ask Pi Cheep if Buakaw is good.
0:17:15.647,0:17:20.037
You want to know, right? Ask him.
He will answer. Go ahead.
0:17:20.470,0:17:24.463
Buakao has skill and timing.
0:17:24.891,0:17:30.756
But Thai audiences didn't have great
confidence in him [won't bet on him].
0:17:30.756,0:17:34.570
He didn't have stand out skills. Nothing impressive.
0:17:34.570,0:17:39.041
He can't fight with Thais anymore.
Japan is ok. He could win.
0:17:39.041,0:17:46.678
And Saenchai is still very good but
fights with weaker opponents.
0:17:49.175,0:17:52.787
Saenchai has advantages [now], so that people will watch.
0:17:53.203,0:17:58.111
He doesn't have heavy weapons,
but he can show off the art.
0:17:58.111,0:18:01.621
Nothing. He only avades and dances.
0:18:01.621,0:18:04.854
I watch and it makes me sleepy.
0:18:04.854,0:18:08.386
No powerful weapons.
0:18:08.386,0:18:14.602
But he has good skills and strategies. Very good.
0:18:14.602,0:18:19.598
He is a brilliant outside fighter.
Very good skill.
0:18:19.598,0:18:24.931
- Scoring systems now are different from before, right?
- Yes, a lot has changed.
0:18:25.913,0:18:31.936
Scoring back in the day, how did they see the skills, what did gamblers look for?
0:18:31.936,0:18:37.044
They looked if a fighter had heavy
weapons, if they struck at the right spots.
0:18:37.044,0:18:39.896
Both good defense and attacks in the exchanges,
0:18:39.896,0:18:45.131
defend and strike.
That's how they decided who was good.
0:18:47.786,0:18:54.427
That was the past. Today is only strength.
Only fall on top. That's good enough.
0:18:57.503,0:19:06.108
And today...that one was 3:1.
Just hit like this [barely slaps Sylvie]. And that was enough.
0:19:06.965,0:19:08.661
I asked the judges!
0:19:08.661,0:19:10.972
I asked the judge, I said let me ask you something:
0:19:10.972,0:19:14.691
Warnings affect points a lot, right?
0:19:14.691,0:19:17.960
He said "you know Muay Thai".
0:19:17.960,0:19:21.939
I asked now red is 5:1 or 3:1.
0:19:21.939,0:19:27.971
then red broke the rules,
he grabbed the ropes.
0:19:27.971,0:19:31.761
The referee warned him not to grab the ropes.
0:19:31.761,0:19:32.761
from 3:1 becomes equal.
0:19:34.118,0:19:37.982
To get ahead 3:1, you have to
strike at the right spots [for high scores].
0:19:37.982,0:19:42.364
Then you remove red's score [through penalty].
It's always this way. [a ref controls the score]
0:19:42.364,0:19:45.593
I said I saw this happen in many fights.
0:19:45.593,0:19:46.593
He just walked away.
0:19:47.970,0:19:49.979
You know? I think...
0:19:51.274,0:19:56.385
this referee who gave the warning was close
to someone with authority.
0:19:56.385,0:19:58.494
If I warn [as a referee], your points are gone.
So if a powerful gambler is losing they don't have to pay.
0:19:58.494,0:20:01.417
If you get a warning, your points are gone.
It's difficult to win.
0:20:02.369,0:20:04.710
The gambling price increases.
0:20:04.710,0:20:09.003
If you judge in this way, it's not good.
If you want to cut him off, just do it.
0:20:09.003,0:20:12.193
Right? This is very bad in the Muay Thai world.
0:20:12.603,0:20:15.170
Referees and judges only want money.
0:20:17.235,0:20:19.243
Is it right what I said?
0:20:20.092,0:20:23.195
This is the bad thing for the Muay Thai community.
0:20:24.053,0:20:31.528
It makes it so the Muay Thai or boxing
community cannot progress.
0:20:31.528,0:20:34.001
People lose faith.
0:20:34.001,0:20:36.984
Back in our day, we really competed.
0:20:39.360,0:20:42.881
It's not the same at all anymore.
0:20:44.660,0:20:53.079
Now you go watch a fight... In the past,
the opponent teeped and you took it.
0:20:53.079,0:20:54.858
You got teeped, you got hit here [in the groin] and fought on.
0:20:54.858,0:20:58.209
These days, they get teeped and it's all...
[acting like they can't continue from pain]
0:20:58.209,0:21:03.134
- No, they act like they can't be touched.
- This is from foreigners. This is "farang style."
0:21:03.134,0:21:05.770
For foreigners [if hit in the groin], the fight stops for 5 minutes!
0:21:07.020,0:21:14.721
I was a referee, if a fighter got hit and didn't keep moving, I'd start counting him.
0:21:14.721,0:21:22.133
Once he was hit really hard, Pi Cheep.
He survived.
0:21:23.915,0:21:28.264
No. He was hit like this, it wasn't forbidden before. [to knee the cup directly]
0:21:28.264,0:21:30.400
Ask him about it!
0:21:30.400,0:21:35.746
If today fighters are hit the way he was
hit, they will fall down. They are cowards.
0:21:36.395,0:21:37.609
Doesn't it hurt your own knee to hit the cup?
0:21:37.609,0:21:41.031
- It doesn't hurt.
- Really, the cup is steel right?
0:21:41.031,0:21:45.378
- Hit here
- oh the edge of it
0:21:45.378,0:21:49.646
In the past, we'd take hard strikes there and we'd take it.
Nowadays, it barely touches and they're like...
0:21:49.646,0:21:54.014
In the past we hit hard. Almost died.
Pi Cheep, you took some hard ones, right?
0:21:54.014,0:21:56.436
- Many people did
- Yes, many people
0:21:57.290,0:22:04.049
I got hit a lot, mostly because
I was Muay Mat [puncher].
0:22:04.049,0:22:07.295
I had to take shots to get in.
0:22:08.610,0:22:17.579
To defend against punchers,
you use long arms to protect yourself.
0:22:18.639,0:22:24.061
To defend against punching. you need good eyes.
When the opponent moves...
0:22:24.061,0:22:29.152
jab, guard, grab.
When they come close, grab the neck to lock.
0:22:34.620,0:22:39.580
In the past, it was easy for Thai fighters to
move to Western style boxing.
0:22:39.580,0:22:41.331
But now there aren't many, right?
0:22:41.331,0:22:43.115
What do you mean?
0:22:43.115,0:22:46.042
Many people started with Muay Thai.
Then became
0:22:46.067,0:22:50.480
World Champion in
Western style boxing.
0:22:50.480,0:22:57.276
They didn't need a big transition, like Sagat's 3rd Western Boxing fight was for World Champion.
0:22:57.276,0:23:00.883
It was possible. But I don't see this now.
0:23:02.115,0:23:03.490
Have some [fruit put on the table].
0:23:03.490,0:23:10.956
These questions. Thai fighters mostly
don't train international style.
0:23:10.956,0:23:13.630
Only Chatchai [Sasakul], right?
0:23:13.630,0:23:17.660
Chatchai was the only one who
changed to only Western Boxing, right?
0:23:17.660,0:23:22.931
Chatchai and Pon [Weerapol]
0:23:22.931,0:23:26.824
Not many people focused on
Western style boxing.
0:23:26.824,0:23:30.981
Nowadays they start from Muay Thai.
0:23:30.981,0:23:37.430
Somrak, Samson Isaan, Sirimongkol
0:23:37.430,0:23:40.698
They started from Muay Thai.
0:23:48.700,0:23:52.414
Sometimes they got to be world champion.
Not bad at all.
0:23:52.414,0:23:54.976
They are heavier weight classes.
0:23:54.976,0:23:58.982
They jab like a horse's kick.
0:23:58.982,0:24:01.568
I got an eye injury from that [fighting against boxers].
0:24:02.377,0:24:05.578
I got eye injury.
I didn't dodge away from the punch.
0:24:05.578,0:24:07.156
It was an accident, you see?
0:24:07.156,0:24:09.922
A Southpaw, no wait...
0:24:09.922,0:24:12.208
He lost a world championship.
0:24:12.208,0:24:15.622
Hia Goo contacted me for the fight.
I fought at 130 lbs at that time.
0:24:15.622,0:24:18.604
Pi Chart [Kongthoranee] was 145 lbs.
Hia Goo didn't let him fight though.
0:24:18.604,0:24:25.649
The contract said 145 lbs is 500,000 Baht. 140 lbs is
450,000 Baht. He left right away...
0:24:31.007,0:24:36.171
...You have to control his range.
0:24:36.365,0:24:43.525
You can control his range with leg kicks, or teeps.
0:24:43.525,0:24:46.678
That's important. So he can't kick.
0:24:46.678,0:24:49.038
He can't come in.
0:24:50.378,0:24:53.291
If you want to punch,
you need to use other techniques first.
0:24:53.291,0:24:56.947
Teep, kick then go in to punch.
0:24:56.947,0:25:01.266
If you just walk in,
and the opponent has a long punch,
0:25:01.266,0:25:03.931
then kicks and teeps,
you won't be able to punch him.
0:25:03.931,0:25:09.179
You need to go in with other weapons.
0:25:15.049,0:25:22.874
Ask him, Sylvie. He said start with other
techniques. What other techniques?
0:25:24.860,0:25:28.883
They would be teep, jab...
0:25:29.790,0:25:33.309
especially hook.
0:25:36.577,0:25:41.732
If the opponent is advancing, the hook is good.
You hook and move away to the other side.
0:25:41.732,0:25:43.321
He can't reach you.
0:25:47.642,0:25:52.815
Like this, long guard and close distance. Step all the way to your opponent, close in.
0:25:52.815,0:25:55.235
And move away.
0:25:55.930,0:25:58.606
He never flinched.
Pi Cheep was never surprised.
0:25:58.967,0:26:02.679
If his opponent stepped, he moved.
0:26:03.133,0:26:07.980
I'd come after him and he just.
moved away to the side and then...
0:26:07.980,0:26:10.416
You didn't kick a lot, right?
0:26:10.416,0:26:14.998
Doi [Dieselnoi's play name], what do you want? We have Coke, with sugar or without?
0:26:14.998,0:26:20.567
No sugar, please.
0:26:34.288,0:26:36.896
Pi Cheep would stand "sabai sabai".
He wouldn't be tense.
0:26:36.896,0:26:41.927
And he wouldn't stand flat footed.
Standing flat will slow you down.
0:26:43.044,0:26:45.412
- Is it right?
- yes
0:26:47.659,0:26:52.166
Then kick and kick. Not hard kicks, but fast.
0:26:52.166,0:26:56.371
But once he got in close close, a hard kick to the leg.
0:26:56.371,0:26:59.802
If he was far, not hard kicks. Only touching.
0:27:00.634,0:27:02.466
Try stepping in to kick.
0:27:02.466,0:27:04.196
Come in and kick.
0:27:04.196,0:27:05.307
No, come in and knee.
0:27:07.883,0:27:09.931
Right? [to Wichannoi] Like this, right?
0:27:13.305,0:27:15.189
Look. you come in and I move to the side.
0:27:15.676,0:27:18.370
Then punch in combinations.
0:27:18.370,0:27:22.074
And if they're left handed, it's even closer...
0:27:22.448,0:27:29.700
He will look for the right timing. If we're the
same height, he would punch like this.
0:27:29.700,0:27:34.755
- He will punch fast.
- I am done.
0:27:35.356,0:27:37.886
Ask him. Ask him.
0:27:41.460,0:27:42.689
Is it right?
0:27:44.000,0:27:50.403
I told her already. Most important...
0:27:51.445,0:27:54.754
First, you need mental strength.
0:27:54.754,0:28:01.901
In fighting, it's only between two people in the ring.
0:28:01.901,0:28:04.383
Handle the opponent's style.
It means..
0:28:04.383,0:28:07.788
what technique he uses,
you plan how to handle his strengths.
0:28:10.907,0:28:14.880
In the ring, if the opponent comes at you this
way, what do you do? You have to think.
0:28:14.880,0:28:16.094
Is it right?
0:28:16.945,0:28:23.249
You know yourself. If he doesn't like knees, you get in but you're too slow.
0:28:23.249,0:28:27.875
Your trainer tells you to knee,
but you know you can't.
0:28:27.875,0:28:32.695
You need to think and move in with other techniques
first before being able to knee.
0:28:33.035,0:28:35.309
Those things are everything.
0:28:36.329,0:28:38.360
Pi Cheep has all of those qualities.
0:28:38.360,0:28:42.712
For other fighters, the corner said to knee so he only tries to knee.
0:28:42.712,0:28:46.389
The opponent defends.
And he still just keeps trying to knee, only.
0:28:46.389,0:28:49.514
It means he doesn't think for himself. He doesn't
adjust his strategy to the situation.
0:28:50.177,0:28:52.016
Right? The corner said to knee, so he just knees.
0:28:52.016,0:28:54.791
A fighter should listen to and follow his corner's advice,
0:28:54.816,0:28:57.283
but he needs to start
with other techniques.
0:28:57.283,0:28:59.725
He has to think.
0:29:00.405,0:29:05.690
I think for Western fighters, we go in
with a plan.
0:29:05.690,0:29:10.479
Like, OK, I've seen he does this, so I'll do that.
0:29:10.479,0:29:15.012
But you can't do this, right?
You have to look at them in front of you in the ring.
0:29:15.012,0:29:21.364
Maybe they kick you and it looked good in video but you feel it yourself and it's not powerful...
0:29:33.639,0:29:38.233
Can you tell her how you trained?
0:29:42.447,0:29:48.519
Train earnestly, concentrate and have intention.
0:29:48.853,0:29:55.506
Most important thing is to know
what your opponent is good at.
0:29:57.757,0:30:02.240
For example the opponent
is good at punching.
0:30:03.240,0:30:05.124
No matter right handed or left handed.
0:30:06.377,0:30:12.432
You need to have your guard high right away.
0:30:12.432,0:30:15.630
You need good eyes and a strong guard.
0:30:15.630,0:30:20.912
For techniques against a puncher you need a long punch,
0:30:20.912,0:30:25.846
teep, kick, and a spear knee.
0:30:25.846,0:30:29.103
These are techniques for fighting punchers.
0:30:29.469,0:30:32.276
Whether you can do or not
0:30:32.276,0:30:36.005
depends on how good you can time your opponent
0:30:36.005,0:30:39.927
to see his moves. This is very important.
0:30:41.044,0:30:45.045
You really have to see your opponent. In Muay Thai, it comes down to handling your opponent.
0:30:45.045,0:30:50.412
For kickers, you make it so he can't reach you.
0:30:50.424,0:30:51.991
When he kicks, you step back.
0:30:51.991,0:30:54.152
When he moves,
you teep to push him out.
0:30:54.678,0:30:57.757
If he kicks high, you kick low.
0:30:57.757,0:31:00.068
With these tactics,
the opponent can't do anything to you.
0:31:00.659,0:31:06.767
It depends on your ability to see and your training.
0:31:06.767,0:31:10.103
When you train,
you know your technique and style.
0:31:11.300,0:31:15.461
What are the techniques to handle different
styles so you can defeat them?
0:31:15.507,0:31:17.459
How to fight to gain
advantage over the opponent?
0:31:17.459,0:31:21.279
That is your training plan, every day.
0:31:21.591,0:31:24.767
When you get into the ring for a fight,
you have to see and think.
0:31:24.767,0:31:28.444
You train this way. When the
opponent moves, you know right away how to handle him.
0:31:28.444,0:31:32.462
You see and know. You solved it in training.
So you can handle any style.
0:31:32.810,0:31:36.082
Most important thing is your mind.
0:31:37.204,0:31:41.044
Your brain tells your
body to move and act -
0:31:41.044,0:31:44.070
in or out. Kick or something else.
0:31:44.582,0:31:49.104
During the fight, what do you look at?
0:31:49.104,0:31:53.757
Look from here to chest. That's enough.
0:31:55.509,0:31:57.458
You can see everything, right?
0:31:57.458,0:32:03.993
Look at the chest and torso - it's a big target.
Look at the face
0:32:03.993,0:32:05.966
When the opponent moves,
you know right away.
0:32:06.901,0:32:08.351
You see he is about to kick.
You will ...
0:32:08.351,0:32:10.536
He is about to punch. You will...
0:32:10.536,0:32:15.712
There are postures for different
techniques you will need to look at. It's about timing.
0:32:17.420,0:32:20.650
How will you handle punchers? Remember?
0:32:20.650,0:32:24.267
You train and prepare. When the
opponent moves, you act right away.
0:32:24.267,0:32:26.587
Like against a puncher,
the opponent moves, you will...
0:32:27.653,0:32:28.737
Strong arms
0:32:28.737,0:32:31.478
push and block.
0:32:31.478,0:32:35.002
If he comes closer, grab him right away.
0:32:35.500,0:32:40.248
If you want to have good timing,
0:32:40.248,0:32:42.401
how do you improve that?
0:32:42.401,0:32:50.196
Sparring? Shadow boxing?
What is best for improving your timing?
0:32:50.196,0:32:53.476
Padwork is the best for timing.
0:32:53.476,0:32:55.524
- Pads, really?
- Yes, pads.
0:32:55.524,0:32:58.746
You can practice control with padwork.
0:32:58.746,0:33:01.215
If the opponent likes pressing forward,
make padman move around.
0:33:01.215,0:33:05.704
You can punch and angle off.
0:33:06.526,0:33:12.625
If the opponent likes to stay back
and maintain distance,
0:33:12.625,0:33:15.827
you need to step in and block.
0:33:15.827,0:33:19.309
In training, when the opponent steps
away, you follow and block as you come in.
0:33:23.175,0:33:28.764
Footwork is very important.
0:33:29.701,0:33:34.412
Look at me. I am short.
I fought with tall fighters.
0:33:34.412,0:33:37.581
How could I survive?
0:33:45.532,0:33:53.032
Good footwork, good eyes
0:33:53.032,0:33:59.379
Training is important.
Training plan and a good trainer.
0:33:59.379,0:34:06.205
Trainers will coach us in training.
0:34:06.205,0:34:07.562
How you train is your advantage.
0:34:08.568,0:34:09.603
That's the truth.
0:34:09.603,0:34:16.180
You can't just train the same way no matter
who your opponent is. It won't work.
0:34:16.180,0:34:19.484
You have to be able to handle
different styles of opponents.
0:34:22.390,0:34:28.026
It is its own style -
1, 2, uppercut, hook.
0:34:28.026,0:34:31.199
Sometimes we put all of them together.
0:34:34.232,0:34:37.236
Use all of them at the
same time, in one set.
0:34:37.236,0:34:38.343
We call it a "set" [a combination]
0:34:40.931,0:34:43.921
Don't use too much power. right?
0:34:44.778,0:34:46.541
Can't use a lot of power.
0:34:46.541,0:34:47.499
No! Use power!
0:34:47.499,0:34:49.763
But if you use a lot of power,
will it land or not?
0:34:50.803,0:34:54.921
Pi Chatchai Sasakul, a Western Style Boxer.
0:34:54.921,0:34:58.850
He said it rarely lands on the target if you punch with 100% power.
0:34:58.850,0:35:02.902
If use only 70%, you'll be more accurate, hit the target more.
0:35:02.902,0:35:04.499
Oh, when you are using timing and speed.
0:35:04.499,0:35:08.782
Correct. If you punch hard, it will be
too slow and won't hit the right spot.
0:35:10.326,0:35:16.051
When the opponent moves away,
you have to be fast to react.
0:35:16.123,0:35:19.437
Sylvie, Chatchai was Pi Cheep's student,
when he was young.
0:35:24.891,0:35:27.556
Petchyindee, yes.
0:35:27.556,0:35:30.882
Chatchai at Petchyindee.
0:35:32.524,0:35:37.996
When they were young.
0:35:39.076,0:35:41.809
Tell Chatchai you talked to Wichannoi, he'll be pleased.
0:35:45.270,0:35:47.667
He was fast.
0:35:47.667,0:35:53.169
He was fast when he did Muay Thai. [Chatchai]
He liked Muay Khao. He had a good skill [in Muay Thai].
0:35:53.169,0:35:54.488
Really good skill.
0:35:54.488,0:35:59.100
- It was hard to grab him. He was fast.
- Yes, difficult.
0:36:00.774,0:36:03.873
- Very good, that Chatchai.
- Yeah, he moved in and out so fast.
0:36:03.873,0:36:09.203
Good movement, fast hands, and he didn't get tired.
0:36:10.010,0:36:13.110
And good eyes.
0:36:14.541,0:36:17.019
I still remember it.
0:36:17.019,0:36:19.427
Pi Cheep fought with
Padejseuk at Rajadamnern.
0:36:19.427,0:36:21.185
The winner of that fight would fight me.
0:36:21.185,0:36:22.648
I went to watch.
0:36:22.648,0:36:28.150
Pi Cheep lost in their last fight,
so this was a rematch.
0:36:31.609,0:36:35.175
They got in the ring, focused on the fight.
0:36:35.175,0:36:38.252
Padejseuk thought he was fresh.
0:36:40.006,0:36:43.360
He punched Pi Cheep. Pi Cheep dodged.
0:36:43.360,0:36:46.641
Then Pi Cheep threw in a bunch of punches.
0:36:47.836,0:36:51.123
I was shocked.
0:36:51.554,0:36:54.047
Pi Cheep was like... remember?
0:36:54.055,0:36:56.829
Pi Cheep threw all these punches and then the bell rang.
0:36:56.829,0:37:01.421
Pi Cheep threw so many punches.
Padejseuk got dizzy.
0:37:01.421,0:37:03.824
In just one more minute he would have been KO'd.
0:37:03.824,0:37:07.628
The bell rang. The cornermen jumped in to
carry the other guy back to the corner.
0:37:07.628,0:37:08.899
I was so shocked.
0:37:12.292,0:37:15.063
I was at a disadvantage because
I was short.
0:37:15.063,0:37:16.202
You were smart.
0:37:16.628,0:37:21.128
When I fought,
timing was very important.
0:37:22.070,0:37:27.021
If I got the right timing, I had to move
in and try to score as much as I could.
0:37:27.422,0:37:28.919
Very good timing.
0:37:29.261,0:37:31.625
It was like this because I was short, right?
0:37:31.625,0:37:35.290
Opportunities and openings are few, so timing is important.
0:37:35.787,0:37:38.728
- remember this.
- find the right timing.
0:37:38.728,0:37:43.723
When you get the timing right,
get in and score as much as possible.
0:37:48.967,0:37:52.347
Sylvie, you close in. The opponent moves away...
0:37:52.347,0:37:56.158
You don't have this tactic yet.
0:37:56.600,0:37:59.829
You have to train and be fast.
0:37:59.829,0:38:06.700
Dieselnoi said to me the last time we fought,
"I will defeat you."
0:38:06.700,0:38:09.318
"Don't expect me to get close."
0:38:10.037,0:38:12.914
And he never came close,
just teeped and kicked.
0:38:13.995,0:38:16.606
He's so long, too.
0:38:17.130,0:38:19.419
Pi Cheep, he always went all-out.
0:38:19.419,0:38:23.069
I finally beat Pi Cheep. I knew you fought your best.
0:38:23.069,0:38:25.203
Pi Cheep never lost.
0:38:25.203,0:38:29.194
When I defeated him, he was already at the end of his career. You know why? Because he was older.
0:38:29.194,0:38:31.034
Pi Cheep, I saw it.
0:38:31.207,0:38:37.420
I knew right away. You can't do it [the same] anymore.
You had fought for a l
0:38:37.420,0:38:42.837
Leading up to stopping, how were you?
Were you hurt?
0:38:43.290,0:38:45.106
I couldn't move as
fast as I wished to.
0:38:46.097,0:38:48.309
I couldn't strike with the same timing.
I couldn't react as fast.
0:38:48.309,0:38:49.516
This is when he was retiring [last fight at 32, in 1980]
0:38:50.056,0:38:56.000
When he was young,
he could strike fast and hard,
0:38:56.000,0:38:58.661
later... not as fast as he wanted to be.
0:39:13.857,0:39:16.734
If I saw the chance,
I would strike as much as I could.
0:39:19.016,0:39:22.737
If he didn't see the opportunity,
he would wait and look for openings.
0:39:22.737,0:39:26.394
He would continue to fight, he wouldn't accept losing but watched to control the game.
0:39:26.394,0:39:31.272
Once he saw the chance, he would hit hard.
Once he saw the opening, he wouldn't wait.
0:39:32.004,0:39:33.471
A whole combination of strikes.
0:39:36.471,0:39:42.177
From what I saw, Pi Cheep always had a plan.
0:39:42.912,0:39:45.776
He would study his opponents.
He wouldn't train for the sake of training.
0:39:45.776,0:39:48.445
In normal training,
he trained on everything -
0:39:48.445,0:39:51.130
kicks, punches, everything.
0:39:51.130,0:39:54.511
When he was training for a fight, he would study the opponent.
0:39:54.511,0:39:56.457
What was their style, what kind of fighter?
0:39:56.823,0:40:00.767
If the opponent likes
to kick and stay away,
0:40:00.767,0:40:04.789
tell the trainer to kick and stay
away in training. And you follow.
0:40:04.789,0:40:09.944
Train this way. Then use this
strategy in the actual match.
0:40:09.944,0:40:11.412
- I understand.
- Understand?
0:40:13.613,0:40:16.613
When you plan,
you must be able to follow the plan.
0:40:16.613,0:40:22.944
You made your plan. You must
follow your plan in the actual match.
0:40:22.944,0:40:24.030
You will win.
0:40:24.649,0:40:30.999
Sometimes you can't do as planned. You
get in, but he is faster than you had thought.
0:40:30.999,0:40:32.563
Much faster
0:40:34.157,0:40:37.709
There are a lot of fighters in the gym.
0:40:37.709,0:40:39.717
But we have different styles.
0:40:39.717,0:40:42.779
Some are punchers, some knee really well...
0:40:42.779,0:40:45.663
so we can all train together to improve, right?
0:40:46.130,0:40:52.160
You have to know everything, punchers or
anything, you must train on all techniques.
0:40:52.160,0:40:56.985
Then in a fight, you see the opponent and have versatility to handle the opponent's technique.
0:40:58.079,0:41:00.744
You can't always handle everyone, you can't always win.
0:41:00.744,0:41:02.919
But train right and you have 80% chance of winning.
0:41:03.787,0:41:06.603
Because you know the opponent.
80% chance of winning for sure.
0:41:08.658,0:41:11.930
Doi is considered one of the
best fighters ever in Thailand.
0:41:13.598,0:41:19.051
Normally tall fighters
are clumsy and awkward.
0:41:19.051,0:41:21.718
Weapons are normally not powerful.
0:41:21.718,0:41:26.473
But he was not clumsy.
His weapons were powerful. And fast.
0:41:26.473,0:41:29.564
His strikes are quite fast for a tall fighter.
0:41:30.642,0:41:34.327
He was one of the best fighters of all time.
0:41:36.141,0:41:39.725
He was one of the best in Thailand.
0:41:41.408,0:41:46.519
There are not many tall fighters who are Yodmuay.
0:41:46.519,0:41:51.890
Most of them broke their legs.
Only Potsai and me were at the top.
0:41:52.130,0:41:54.492
When we fought with Pi Cheep,
0:41:54.492,0:41:57.682
he beat us all. He was not afraid. [he beat Potsai 3x, Dieselnoi 2x]
0:41:57.682,0:42:01.027
As he said, tall fighters are clumsy.
0:42:01.027,0:42:03.827
When he was hit with knees, he knew how to focus.
0:42:04.510,0:42:06.970
He was skillful.
0:42:06.970,0:42:08.656
If he was hit with knee on this
side, he moved his body the other side.
0:42:08.656,0:42:11.693
The knee missed.
After you miss & recovery is too slow.
0:42:13.475,0:42:17.539
At that moment,
he would throw counters, after you missed.
0:42:18.832,0:42:23.501
Pi Cheep was fast. He would kick the leg.
0:42:23.501,0:42:26.583
So tall fighters struggle with balance, right?
0:42:26.583,0:42:32.542
If I had fought with you when I was
a bit older, I might have fallen down.
0:42:32.542,0:42:34.942
When I fought with you, I was young.
0:42:35.328,0:42:38.041
Before I fought with you, I didn't
know what "seeing stars" was like.
0:42:38.041,0:42:42.000
Try it now.
Look at the light and blink fast.
0:42:43.614,0:42:46.334
That was when Pi Cheep punched me.
0:42:47.750,0:42:55.126
But I was young. A kid around
15-17 years old has a strong body.
0:42:55.126,0:42:57.402
I trained a lot and was very strong.
0:42:58.652,0:43:03.262
He rocked me with a punch in round 4.
0:43:03.262,0:43:06.862
The King was watching.
But I couldn't stand anymore.
0:43:09.632,0:43:12.477
The bell went off.
I walked to the wrong corner.
0:43:12.477,0:43:17.123
When you punched, it was like...
0:43:18.482,0:43:21.742
It was like...how it's
called..."seeing stars"
0:43:25.607,0:43:32.945
If you didn't close in on me - I wouldn't
fight like I did with other people.
0:43:34.038,0:43:38.911
Because I knew I would get
hurt if I tried to close in on you.
0:43:38.911,0:43:40.677
I would be hit.
0:43:40.677,0:43:46.022
Listen. That first time I was scared.
I was not ready.
0:43:46.022,0:43:53.068
I trained. But I went to see Leekeh shows. I went to Karaoke.
0:43:53.068,0:43:56.945
So many of your opponents all lost.
0:43:56.945,0:44:01.897
When it was over... You know what?
0:44:01.897,0:44:06.507
I thought ... damn it! [Dieselnoi lost their first 2 fights together] But it was fun the first time.
0:44:06.507,0:44:08.845
I thought if I trained well. I could win.
0:44:08.845,0:44:10.562
I lost that first time.
0:44:10.562,0:44:14.505
I trained very well the second time.
0:44:14.505,0:44:16.531
I bet 10,000 Baht on myself.
0:44:17.258,0:44:18.934
I was beaten badly.
0:44:18.934,0:44:20.927
You know how it was?
0:44:21.825,0:44:23.212
Pi Cheep was very smart.
0:44:23.212,0:44:28.130
Pi Cheep was confident and
advanced on me to scare me.
0:44:28.834,0:44:32.126
He came forward and controlled the game.
0:44:32.126,0:44:35.258
I used the strategy, just teep and kick, for the third fight.
0:44:35.258,0:44:37.960
Pi Cheep kicked.
He was losing in that fight.
0:44:37.960,0:44:41.461
The audience booed.
He was behind me for 3 rounds.
0:44:42.192,0:44:43.194
That fight wasn't entertaining.
0:44:43.593,0:44:46.852
The entertaining fight would be that I
came forward because I was taller.
0:44:46.852,0:44:48.263
Then Pi Cheep would defend.
That would be what is entertaining.
0:44:48.263,0:44:52.028
But this fight was short fighter vs long fighter.
It was not exciting. The audience booed.
0:44:52.028,0:44:56.612
When I went to the corner, I thought
only 3 more minutes. I would just wait.
0:44:56.612,0:45:00.847
But I went after him [in the final round] and was was almost knocked out.
0:45:00.847,0:45:05.494
I was hit badly. It hurt so much.
0:45:05.494,0:45:08.194
I was dizzy.
0:45:08.194,0:45:09.441
His strikes were so fast.
0:45:11.023,0:45:12.806
He hit me on the side.
It made my counter knee be off target.
0:45:14.583,0:45:18.317
If a fighter did this to
me, [usually] I could get a good knee on him.
0:45:18.317,0:45:19.610
You know why [it worked for him]?
0:45:19.610,0:45:21.090
He just stood over the shoulder.
0:45:21.090,0:45:24.073
I couldn't get my knee to land on him!
0:45:24.924,0:45:29.725
Right? Pi Cheep would... Then I...
0:45:29.725,0:45:32.953
For me, if an opponent stretches
the arm this way, I would grab them.
0:45:32.953,0:45:35.011
It's my knee range.
0:45:35.534,0:45:41.335
Pi Cheep moved to trick me.
So my knee didn't land right.
0:45:42.260,0:45:44.172
I kneed straight and then he would...
0:45:44.172,0:45:48.109
Other people would punch and block.
I could strike back.
0:45:48.109,0:45:50.850
But Pi Cheep would angle off.
0:45:50.850,0:45:53.909
He turned away to the side.
0:45:57.322,0:46:00.081
Just turn you body away from the weapon.
0:46:00.081,0:46:04.645
Against Muay Khao,
it's easy to turn the body away to dodge.
0:46:05.067,0:46:06.753
Turning is easy.
0:46:06.753,0:46:09.240
- Were you ever startled?
- I could see everything. I was never startled.
0:46:09.240,0:46:13.584
When the opponent steps in,
you know what weapon they'll use.
0:46:14.668,0:46:16.968
If you focus, you won't be surprised.
0:46:16.968,0:46:18.264
It will be ok.
0:46:21.540,0:46:25.460
If you are taken by surprise, you are done.
0:46:25.460,0:46:27.361
Pi Cheep was never surprised.
0:46:27.361,0:46:31.468
He was ready. The opponent came in.
He didn't step back.
0:46:31.468,0:46:34.097
Doi, did you fight with Moo? [Pudpadnoi]
0:46:34.097,0:46:35.558
No, I never fought him.
0:46:35.558,0:46:39.927
When he [Pudpadnoi] came back, he was done.
0:46:44.455,0:46:50.347
I couldn't use your strategy.
You were so patient.
0:46:50.347,0:46:53.270
I watched you fight one time [as a kid] when my brother
went to sell charcoal. [at the stadium]
0:46:53.270,0:46:57.583
I saw you fight. And in "The Ring," magazine.
0:46:58.251,0:47:00.838
It cost 1.5 Baht for that magazine in the past.
0:47:01.627,0:47:03.469
I went to see you fight.
0:47:11.039,0:47:14.712
You were tall but your weapons were ok.
You weren't clumsy and had good strikes.
0:47:14.712,0:47:18.908
You used his weapons well.
0:47:19.998,0:47:25.115
When you two fought,
Arajan Dieselnoi was young, right?
0:47:26.933,0:47:28.726
'27... [probably 1978, about 41 years ago]
0:47:28.726,0:47:31.555
I was around 16 years old. How about you?
0:47:31.555,0:47:35.414
I was around 28-30 years old.
0:47:43.526,0:47:45.456
35 years old when I retired. [...a resource records 32, but maybe he kept fighting]
0:47:45.456,0:47:48.422
35? How many fights in total?
0:47:48.422,0:47:50.676
Probably more than 200.
0:47:50.676,0:47:52.605
Only 200 something?
0:47:54.300,0:48:00.036
- You know how many she fought?
- 252
0:48:01.003,0:48:06.728
- 250 something these days.
- Not the same, Arjarn was Yodmuay.
0:48:06.728,0:48:10.155
But it was more fun in the past.
0:48:10.155,0:48:13.992
Toom fought in Nonthaburi [a district of Bangkok, our location].
There were the best fighters here.
0:48:13.992,0:48:17.310
Just a small stadium. They fought in Nonthaburi.
0:48:18.349,0:48:23.967
Really good fighters. Banglee, too. I mean there was also a stadium in this area.