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Episode 229: Scrolling Towards Bethlehem (Patreon)

Published:
2022-05-31 13:14:41
Edited:
2024-03-05 16:05:26
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We are joined by Ben Tarnoff, author of the forthcoming book Internet for the People to discuss the early wave of internet marketization, platform capitalism, and whether or not we should blow the whole thing up.

Episode 18: DARPA Marx 

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lilfukka

Yes blow it up

Harvey

Can never tell if Liz is serious when she says everyone already got covid

Zachary Manenti

With the use of 30 year hindsight u can sum up the history in this way. But in fact this is an historical summation, a scholarly interpretation, which may have its value and its truth, but i was in my early 20s in 1995, and i wd back Liz on the point there were plenty of things to do online: chat rooms, internet academic research, porn, and let us not forget the explosion of email. Also monetization of the internet was still in play in the 21st aughts…. when donation and subscription were the only experiment to purportedly counter going back to advertising model. I would say it was not so much that there wasn’t a bunch of stuff to do ( activity) on the internet in the 90s, but it wasn’t all organized around consumption of things… it wasn’t all buying and consuming as the major activity of the internet. That is/was the dream of drooling hounds of free market capital. So it is important to differentiate ‘activity’ and ‘not much to do’ from making it easier to buy and consume objects of commerce. More there wasn’t much to buy, not yet what we have today: the massive commodification of every single fucking thing, including info. History is mostly , and IMO wrongly, for the books….its a story, but i was there too. coulda woulda shoulda internet and whatever still lies beyond ….

Cameron Young

Liz - drop the finals prediction- Warriors in 5? MVP?

Zachary Manenti

not ur best guest imo. sorry to tell u really how i feel… haha. he said nothing really in that academic jargony way. poor explanation of trustless decentralized blockchain … not that is a hope to wager any longer. true at least what he said: web 3 is nostalgic for old internet. But pluralization is no answer to the call. he didnt offer much of a view or think thru much… i wd call him pretty libertarian himself. and btw, have we noticed … the mall is no more? hard to take a metaphor seriously esp when it is basically over…even if there was once a spatial link. If i were looking for such a metaphor…i wd call upon Walter Benjamin’s ‘Arcades’ for the transparent commodity marketplace in cyberspace. Look, cybernetics is not bad. process of relations and ‘systems’ seems to be the best description of phenomenological life. But without the social as in socialist ( power of the ppl majority) government to regulate monopoly corporate capitalism, feggedabout it. With some regulation and ppl going for walks 3 hours a day… away from their screens … we wd b able to move away from Black Mirror doom and gloom. But, i wdn’t hold one’s breath.

Anonymous

to brace’s point on whether the internet should really exist or not; there’s an incredible book from the late 70’s by Jerry Mander; “Four Arguments for the Elimination of Television”. Mander was an advertising executive for years and writes at great length about not only the sociocultural, but also physical and, thus reciprocal spiritual effects of mass media consumption. it changed my life more than most any book i’ve read. i can’t recommend it highly enough

Anonymous

lmao brace just fucking with the guest

Anonymous

Had a hard time listening to this episode, all I could hear while Ben was talking was Brace breathing and sucking on his Juul

Sardonic

One thing I'll say as a developer, the low-code revolution is upon us. Arguably being proficient in something like Salesforce is already more valuable than a given single programming language on the resume.

zack wait

Ben sounds just like Tina from Bob's Burgers

Juliette DeMaso

That exchange over double grossie tho.. worth every penny of my five bucks now that the internet has replaced all of the relationships I once had that might have yielded such irl conversations.

Regina Bugarin

okay i NEED to know if this is a mucinex ad please for the love of god TELL ME IT IS i’ve been debating this since may 21, 2022