The Homestuck Epilogues - Discussion (Patreon)

A Monkey's Paw wish. The ancient doubt, the worry, that one's desires may come at a steep price. That nothing in this world comes pain-free and easily. "Watch out for what you wish."

Oh yeah.

We're doing this.

For those out of the loop on what's going on in the Homestuck-sphere- First of all, what are you doing here? There's spoilers ahead and discussion of events that may leave you confused as to what is even going on anymore. But if you're adamant on staying or just want a refresher, we finally got a Homestuck Epilogue, and it's even more contentious and divisive than the Act 7 Ending. For several reasons, some good, some bad, and some that just make one scratch their head.

Let me preface this, however, by saying that I personally enjoyed the Epilogues, and quite a bit! A lot of people seem bent on the idea that the tone of the writing was a little bit too aggressive towards the reader, mocking, even, or that a lot of the points presented were a direct attack from the authors to the Fandom as a whole in a mean-spirited way. I read the Epilogue under the assumption this was a labor of love, and if you can't accept this more positive outlook on their intent, I suggest you leave already, because it's not going to get any less loving!

Andrew Hussie drafted the entire thing, Cepheid Variable wrote the bulk of it, V filled in wherever CV couldn't due to a concussion half-way through development, and alongside a chunk of the WhatPumpkin Team, they built a story with a purpose and for a reason. It's not shitting on the fans just because, nor is it being insulting because fuck you.

So without further ado.

Let's get into the Meat of this discussion shall we?

Now, if you have read the Epilogues, you know that they are divided in two sections. Two Timelines so to say. Meat is the one that complies with the Canonical Events that happen in Homestuck, and is more Plot-Focused. Candy is the one that deviates from Canon and focuses more on the Characters. Neither of them are pleasant, happy continuations to the Act 7 Ending. However if you have read both of these stories, what you will find out is while overarching two different Timelines with alternative sets of events, these two Epilogues showcase a single story.

Dirk Strider's Descent and Alt! Calliope's Ascent as Narrators of the story.

Dirk, consumed by his Ultimate Self, begins to worryingly act more like AR, and to accomplish an unknown goal, starts to manipulate everyone and nudge their actions through the narration, while Calliope, having sealed away everything beyond the Black Hole in the non-canonical world of Candy, prepares to take him on and wrest this narrative agency from him.

As such what the story is actually divided into, is the Meta-Narrative of Dirk and Calliope influencing everything that is going on, and the Events that actually happen to the characters on a physical level, and how they deal with them differently in the two Timelines, over different periods of time.

In this sense, the Epilogues continue the trend started in Homestuck. The situation they are in is different, but the basis is the same. Kids growing up through the hostile world of SBURB and overcoming it. Teens growing up in the hostile narrative of Lord English and overcoming it. And now, with Lord English out of the picture, it's yet another Yaldabaoth that has taken over everything.

Now, many have mentioned how this is a butchering of Dirk's character- Hell, many people think this to be a butchering of most of the characters, even though they're not as OOC as people seem to imply, and the differences between their Homestuck counterparts can easily be explained through either settling down during the 7 Years they have been on Earth-C, them being outright manipulated, or in Dirk's case, due to his communion with his Ultimate Self.

The Ultimate Self in itself happens to be a hot topic of the Epilogues, and something that irked a lot of people, as they consider it- Just like Dirk does- The Ultimate, Best, and eventually Only expression of said character. But as we see in the narrative, that's just not the case. People like Dirk. People believe in Dirk being a good person. But now, suddenly, he's his Ultimate Self and he's awful, so does that mean we can't escape our nature if we're a bad person?

No.

Dirk is a very special case for several reasons. To really understand the Ultimate Self, we have to look at the other character going through something similar. Rose Lalonde. Rose's ascent into her Ultimate Self is painful to watch. She's weakened, she's terrified of what she could become. She has doubts about her identity, her worth, her purpose. And ultimately, manipulated by Dirk, she falls prey of it- And as we learn, a normal body usually cannot handle the Ultimate Self-ification. It's only because Dirk's already used to his splinters that he's even able to live in his current state. And that is when the contradiction begins.

The Ultimate Self is a Narrative Construct. It's not a real, existing, feasible entity. The Ultimate Self is the reduction of everything a character is, has been, and will be. To become your Ultimate Self means to shed your physical body, because the Ultimate Self is a concept. As such, when you give it a vessel, such as Davepeta, or Dirk, you're creating an oxymoron. Once you personify the Ultimate Self, it is not Ultimate anymore, because as people, characters keep evolving, changing, and doing things. An Ultimate Self cannot do. An Ultimate Self only is.

The fallacy Dirk has fallen prey to is the idea that he has become higher than everyone else, but the only thing he's done is peer through the partitions of his mind at everything his character has been, on a narrative level. And by keeping Rose alive through the use of the Rosebot, she, too, has fallen prey to this. They're not becoming their 'ultimate versions', they're taking what they've seen as the Truth, as what's relevant, and in turn given up everything they were. They have regressed.

On top of that, as the complicated character Dirk is, with his splinters, other versions of himself include The Auto-Responder, which is closely tied to the figure of the Yaldabaoth, as a being unable to grow that manipulated their Session. They also include Bro, the abuser that was in contact with a full Lil Cal all of his life. And importantly enough, given Davebot in the Candy route mentions Davepeta, it also seems to include ARquius, the character that became, in turn, a part of Lord English' Soul.

Calliope often compares Dirk to her brother during Meat, and she has all the reason to. It's hard to say if Caliborn's will is showing through him and changing him, but on a Meta-Narrative level, Dirk has become a substitute to Lord English' influence over the canon, although whatever it is he's planning to do in a new SBURB Session, we can only speculate.

My current take is he's heading to the very core of the narrative, where it all started. SBURB, Skaia, and perhaps, whatever the origin of SBURB itself may be. He considers himself above everyone else, above the narrative. A pawn, fallen off the Chess Board, noticing the fabricated reality he's been living in, and foregoing the rest of the pieces as mere cogs in this machine. He's out to fuck up the very foundation of the narrative. Or perhaps not. Only time will tell.

While Dirk is the main antagonist, he's not the only force presented as outright villainous in the Epilogues, however. Where he excels at villainy through the Meta-Narrative, there's yet another character whose actions impact negatively all life on Earth-C.

Early in both Epilogues, we're introduced to the fact Jane's a huge Xenophobe, and that her running for president is very bad and could lead to a Troll Genocide. At least, Karkat overly dramatically states this, while Dave mentions how they would need to be much different people from where they started for that to even be a viable option.

Yeah. Needless to say this was a doozy, and a really worrying development, specially for people who like Jane.

Later on we learn that Jane has some arguments to make regarding the issue- Trolls are a species with a rate of birth much, much higher than those of Humans, as well as lifespans that can extend into the millennia. The scales may be tipped in their favor if they were left unchecked! However, the restrictions she's planning for, are tainted with personal bias regarding her manipulation at the hands of Her Imperious Condescension, the old Alternian Empress. She pushes an anti-Troll agenda because of this, and, ironically, ends up becoming a Condesce-like figure herself.

Just like how Dirk replaces Caliborn, narratively, Jane becomes the new Empress.

It isn't all bad, however. Everything goes off the rails on Candy, and she falls prey of very, very awful tendencies- But also, her manipulation of the Government is shady and secret, and she has that god damn clown by her side pushing her to be even worse. While her points of view still stand on Meat, she isn't that far gone. Specially as she wins the election through Dirk's manipulation, it's putting her on the Spotlight, where she can't do anything shady without being seen. Biased, wrong, awful, but her 'policies' come from what seems like a genuine place of concern, twisted to an extremely wrong end. And with Kanaya angry as fuck, chances are some sense may be getting beaten into her at some point.

These are bad developments. Not in the sense of the story itself being bad, but of these two characters having grown up to become not what any of us wanted. But I don't think that necessarily makes it a shitty twist to the story. Their behavior is not out of the line of what could be plausible for these two characters, it's just... Sad to see them fall so low, it makes you want to see them become good again.

But canon demands conflict, doesn't it?

Herein lies what I believe the Epilogue is trying to convey. "Tales of dubious authenticity" may sound like a cop-out, an easy way out in case people didn't enjoy the Epilogues, but there's more to it than just a safety net.

Tonally speaking, the Epilogues are radically different to everything else in Homestuck, while still holding a fair share of humor and really interesting fuckery of the narrative, the reality presented is quite bleak. But it's not hollow in meaning. It wants to convey a different set of things, to a different audience. It continues the story, but not necessarily in the way we'd all have wanted. And so, its authenticity is 'dubious', a potential sequel of what could be, but it doesn't mean a Happy Ending couldn't have been achieved in other circumstances, and it definitely doesn't want to invalidate Fan input and Fan works.

In Candy, John starts to get weirded out by how everyone just seems to accept some things as fact, as they come. He is angry that Roxy just seems so content alongside him, barely seeming to have a voice. He becomes obsessed with the idea that he's rendered everything irrelevant and messed up, that nothing has a meaning anymore, and so he descends into nihilism.

But we see, even through this incredibly bleak landscape, things aren't what John thinks they are. Rose finds happiness alongside Kanaya, something she was afraid she'd lose. Children are born. A war is being waged. There's no cosmological importance to their actions anymore, but everything they do matters, to the world they live in, to their friends.

Inaction. By considering everything to be bleak and make no sense, by just living in the delusion that nothing matters anymore, things are allowed to become worse and worse yet. But it doesn't matter if there doesn't seem to be a single thing that matters, because we matter, because those we love matter. Even in the worst of situations, even if we're restricted on what we can do- Why not try? Why not live our lives to the fullest extent that we can?

Meanwhile, in Meat, John accepts fate as it comes. He's destined to fight Lord English. He watches his friends die, one by one, and eventually is mortally wounded. The venom coursing through his veins erasing his narrative relevance could be easily seen as no poison at all- John was gravely wounded by the Villain. The Protagonist had a confrontation with the Villain, the Villain was defeated, but at a cost. That is the end of John's cosmological journey. Of his narrative significance. There's no poison. There never was. It's the closure of a Hero's arc.

The Canon Dirk manipulates into being in Meat is visceral and full of conflict. That is what Canon is on the basis of Meat. Things get worse, so that the characters have stakes. And in turn, everyone suffers because of this.

In Candy, we learn that it doesn't matter if things seem irrelevant, we make our own sense of things, and live our lives. In Meat, we learn that sometimes what's Canon is unfair and harmful.

Beneath all the awful stuff in the story, the glimmer of hope, pushing through, wanting us to get invested in having these characters be happy. It's sad. Bad things happen. But it wants us to know even in the worst of times, there's something to do.

And yet, here's where what I believe my only 'complaint' of the Epilogue as a whole comes in.

It's that it is not complete.

Act 7 and the Credits are an Open Ended finale. There's things that haven't been shown, but if you fill them in with the clues given in the text, things start to fall into place.

The Epilogues are not a finale. They 'ruin' the supposed Happy Ending at the end of the journey with more conflict- And that's exactly what it intends. By forcing all loops to be closed canonically, by showing what comes after, 'canon' continues, and more conflict and drama is added upon what people wanted to be a Happy Ending. And the ending of both routes hints to something more going on, to the journey continuing.

The conflict with Lord English was 'closed' in a way, but the conflict with Dirk is still ongoing.

I don't think this makes the Epilogues worse, but where some could consider Act 7 a satisfying conclusion to the story of Homestuck, the Epilogues are simply not the end of a journey, they showcase the beginning of a new one. As such, there's a descent into darkness with a spark of light at the end of the tunnel, but since it ends just as this spark begins showing, the overall tone of the Epilogues remains bleak for what the characters have gone through. In fact, everyone in the Epilogues is dealing with their personal issues from earlier in the story, amplified.

Dave and his conflict with his Brother. Dirk's struggle with himself. Karkat's struggles with leadership. Jade being pushed into a role of inaction. The more things change, the more they stay the same. You could say it is unfair to these characters, and it is. But that's the thing. I don't consider this to be a bad thing. 

It really does seem this is exactly what the story pretends. It makes us feel bad for the characters. It makes us root for them to overcome what's going on. To get the Happy End we wanted them to have. A Retcon to bring John back to life? A Third Choice that fixes things? Candy, with John not being so despondent, or Dirk deciding to just fuck it all.

The Epilogues tease that both choices are bad in their own ways. We need to know an alternative. We need to know what comes after. How they get out of this one. It's a Cliffhanger, and until we have official word on anything that may be coming next? It's definitely not as pleasant of an end as the Credits were.

And whether you consider this a good or a bad story, their intent seems clear to me, and it feels like other than that, it's all up to personal preference.

Speaking of personal preference.

With the overarching themes of the story and the two biggest Villains and the conflicts out of the way though, I want to take a moment here at the end of this essay to talk about the Discourse surrounding the Epilogue.

Oh boy.

Let me just say, before going any deeper with this. I do like the Epilogues. But I also see there's a lot of stuff that could potentially make people feel really bad. The content warnings at the beginning are there for a reason, and specially for people attached to some of the characters, it can be tough. I know. It's very fair that a lot of people dislike the change in tone, as well, given it's a bit darker, or that they overall just don't enjoy the Meta-fuckery the Epilogue is all about!

Disliking it is totally fair. But I do think a lot of people have been going way too far, and that some things are being taken extremely out of context to reinforce this train of negativity built around it.

For example, there's this idea that the tone of the Epilogues is extremely negative towards the fans reading it, like a 'fuck you for liking these characters', which is kind of a big leap, specially considering a good chunk of the actual narration is manipulative, in-character malarkey. There IS teasing of the fans and certain things here and there, but it doesn't step any further than what the comic itself always has? Still, again, it's okay if someone felt personally attacked by the Epilogue, but there's a line between that, and outright stating that the writers Hate the Fans.

Similarly, Gamzee's "Redemption" has been taken by some as an attack on people who like Gamzee, or even on Redemption Arcs in general, instead of the critic towards hollow "Redemption" on the basis that someone was abused in the past and that it justifies everything bad they've done.

Jake goes through a lot of awful stuff, but there's the glimmer of development with him at the end of Candy, and with Dave and Karkat in Meat before Dirk manipulates him.

Jade, too, a lot of people have demonized for her being too pushy with Karkat in her attempts to get with Dave and Karkat, but not only does Meat give a more healthy example of their relationship, Jade explicitly tries to be a bit of a Kismesis to Karkat. Still pushy, but definitely not on the level some people have been calling her out on.

Even one of the best and most interesting developments in the Epilogue, Roxy's exploration of their gender identity, and how they express it differently across Timelines, implying a quite fluid expression overall, has had hate thrown at it because it... Ruined a wlw character?

Mind you, I don't think any of this criticism is undeserved or that people should just shut up. Everyone has different takes and opinions on the story, and people can definitely take different meanings from the text. There's a lot to discuss about what the Epilogue potentially did right and wrong, its strengths, its shortcomings, how they handled more triggering material and the kind of narrative they went for.

But there's been a trend of trying to take every single thing about the Epilogue in the most negative way possible without a second thought, and reinforcing this narrative that the writers really must hate everyone. 

Wait! But is that really wrong? People disliked it so they have the right to complain about it since it's not something that met their expectations! I'm saying that people have the right to dislike it, but also criticizing people who do, and trying to explain MY personal view on what these characters are doing and going through, as if trying to justify it all- Am I an hypocrite?

Maybe! Maybe I am a bit of an hypocrite. But also, this stewing hatred towards it has led to people sending manipulative hatred towards the writers, and even in one account, tried to doxx one of the writers of the epilogue to dig dirt against them and send them death threats.

Not everyone who's hating on the Epilogue is doing this evidently, it's a small portion of people- Vocal, but small. But the very fact this is a thing that is happening at all is baffling, and it is being heavily reinforced by the spiral of negativity surrounding it. Disliking it is okay, but focusing on constantly bashing it and trying to find more and more ways to call it problematic, and bashing on people who did enjoy the content of the Epilogue, is kind of shitty!

At one point I even saw people comparing it to the Skaianet Fiasco, and I will admit that made me really mad. Because when the Skaianet Cursed History came out, with planning documents written by Hussie years ago, unchecked and with problematic, antisemitic overtones, the backlash was well deserved and addressed properly. And to say this was worse than that when the narrative pushed is overtly anti-fascist and queer, even with its darker undertones, just tells me that people weren't concerned about the antisemitism back then, and were just trying to find ways of bashing something they disliked.

Dislike the Epilogue all you want, and have your own takes on it. But be critical when you try to push that hatred beyond, because a lot of people are throwing around how awful and problematic and completely repulsive it is, when it really just seems it depicted things they didn't want to happen to their favorite characters, and are spinning it way out of context.

So please, really.

Don't fucking doxx the writers and send them death threats.

See you next time with something lighter, hopefully! And any further questions regarding the Epilogue, feel free to add them as a comment or send me a message on Tumblr! With the Spoiler Embargo lifted, I'm much more comfortable talking about things now.