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Episode 515 - The Picture of Dorian Gray - Part 2 (Patreon)

Published:
2020-09-14 16:53:09
Imported:
2021-07
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Content

It's Part 2 of THE PICTURE OF DORIAN GRAY - 2 OSCAR 2 WILDE!

We're joined once again by writer and Skins creator Jamie Brittain!

Fragrant thanks to reader Greig Johnson!

Music in this episode: Ballade No.1 Op.23 and Nocturne No. 1 by Chopin + In the Dark by Bix Beiderbecke.

Comments

Anonymous

loved part 1, can't wait for part 2! also, my other favourite podcast just did an episode on Oscar Wilde this weekend! DEFINITELY worth checking out https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-final-straw-radio/id1145532412?i=1000491116373

Devin Trim

Wow, the impression you guys did of Dorian sobbing at Sylvia’s acting sounded was great. Sounded just like my first time reading that scene in this book. I even fainted afterward and then slipped on my own tears as I was getting back up. Good times...

Devin Trim

*was great

Devin Trim

**Sybil. Damn it, two typos in one comment. My bad.

Anonymous

Loving this discussion, my Wilde boon companions! One of my favorite passages is the scene of Dorian justifying to himself continuing his behavior. Depending on your point of view (and age, and experience) this scene can be funny, infuriating, pathetic, hit far too close to home, or . . . well, suffice it to say that it can be seen from all sorts of angles. Which goes a long way to proving Wilde's skill. He presents the scene and lets the reader decide how to interpret it. The man knew how to bend words and trigger arguments.

Anonymous

Stopped smoking 25 years ago, but yeah this story does make me remember that craving for the most needless unsatisfying vice ever to be. Even more than Less than Zero, I think American Psycho is the quintessential Ellis novel doing Dorian today. Really really want the Brittan- Fifer-Lackey production of The Screw You Letters: An Epistolary War of Inebriation. Call Netflix please. At this point in the story, I have to admit that I’ve never been able to get beyond a queer reading, “Close reading” was always boring anyway. I know that there are limits to trying to make a 19th century aesthete like Wilde into a gay hero and role model of today, despite Hollywood and pop culture investing a lot of energy into doing just that. However, I’ve always read Dorian, as well as The Importance… and some short fiction like the obvious The Portrait of Mr W. H. as Wilde using his dazzling intellect and repartee to blast the world around him for its obvious hypocrisy. Challenging everyone or at least Victorian England to put up or shut up. Dorian, Lord Henry and Basil are gay in the sexual and cultural connotations of that word, but not allowed to truly be so resulting in the horror. Of course, I think Wilde would’ve rejected using any term so scientific as homosexual as being crass and therefore ugly and boring, themes constantly returned to by both Lord Henry and Dorian. Certainly, the overriding theme in this story is, as you all discussed, how appearance as morality fails, becoming another form of constant consumption ultimately leading to a spiritual if not literal self-cannibalism. But so very near the surface is Wilde preaching. That isn’t really the right word, too plebian, but saying this is the result of a hypocritical pseudo-religious caste society denying what is self-evident when it comes to desire constrained by absurd rules half-followed by everyone. Lord Henry and Dorian are horrible men to the women in their lives, as well as to everyone, as this is the only way they are allowed to be. Obviously, others have taken other tacks, for example the influence of his mother, both in terms of Irish nationalism as well as women’s right or his love of all things classical, also connected to mom, as being avenues to read The Picture as a critique of all things England. I can’t remember when I first read it, but I must have been a teen and already aware that I wasn’t like most other boys when it came to the whole liking girls thing. Besides being a source of come-backs and one liners guaranteed to make me less popular and more weird than walking around with worn paperbacks with Frazetta covers of uber-brawny men or names like Lovecraft, this story told me it may not get better, but it will definitely get dramatic.

Anonymous

When Dorian was shoehorned into the League of Extraordinary Gentlemen film, ignoring the actual point of his character in favour of a cheap superpower, there was an interview with Alan Moore who was bemused by the decision to include him. In a way it seemed like the film makers had the same superficial reaction to the painting's abilities that Dorian himself had, pushing aside any reservations and choosing to concentrate purely on the apparent benefits; people who find the ending of the story absurd also seem to be so in love with concept that they can't imagine any downside worth worrying about. Moore himself was baffled as to how such a character could be used in a LEG scene, imagining the typical interactions as "Hello Dorian, you're looking well."

Anonymous

What I think we all want to see, though, is the hideously wicked picture we now know Chad has hidden away of him debauching a dish mop.

Jason Thompson
>>44079727

I remember I was semi-pleasantly amused when I realized that Gray was in the movie. Of course the whole movie was so incredibly awful, mild amusement was as good as it gets...

Anonymous

The opening of this episode gave me a mental image of Greig just standing in a room having a conversation with himself, and I love it.

Anonymous
>>44063959

This show has indelibly colored my experience of certain stories. Next time I read Wuthering Heights or Seaton's Aunt, I'll "hear" them in Rachel's voice, for example.

Anonymous

Really enjoying these episodes. New to Patreon so unsure if this has come up before but has anyone suggested Saki for the podcast? Similar to Wilde in tone and there are a few Weird tales in there like Sredni Vashtar The Music on the Hill or Tobermory.

Anonymous

I’ve been listening to HPL’s letters over on Voluminous, and there’s more than a little of Lord Henry’s claims that ethical concerns are secondary to aesthetic ones in Lovecraft’s self-presentation at many stages of his life. He’s frequently going on about how he doesn’t like bad actions not because they’re wrong but because they’re unaesthetic.

Anonymous

I'm overjoyed that you're finally covering "The Picture of Dorian Gray." It's one of my favorite novels and the 1945 adaptation still has a special place in my nightmares (those colorized shots of the portrait!). I'm surprised that you haven't gone more into the Narcissus myth with this story as there are a lot of similarities between Dorian and Narcissus (such as Basil being somewhat akin to Echo, Sibyl Vane being Ameinias while her brother Harry is Nemesis, or the portrait being akin to the pool of water where he sees himself). The story of Dorian Gray is very much a Greek tragedy where Hubris is the sin that leads the main character and nearly everyone around them to some form of mutual destruction (Agamemnon, Jason and Medea, Icarus, etc.). I would very much love to see this story being retold in a modern landscape where Dorian is an average person, the portrait is their online profile made by their best friend who thinks they should get on social media, and Lord Henry can be one of the influencers who sold the fiasco that was Fyre Festival.