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594. Shooting Threes: Oldboy (Patreon)

Published:
2023-05-19 13:01:01
Imported:
2023-12
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Our intrepid hosts are covering Park Chan-Wook’s “Vengeance Trilogy!” Last episode was the first installment: Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance. But today, the gals are covering the much more famous Oldboy! Also it’s the NBA Finals, so you should definitely listen to this show NOW.

Features:

Bridgett Greenberg: https://twitter.com/BridgettTweets

Sarah Griffith: https://twitter.com/sk_griffith

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E l i j a h

The opposite of the vengeance trilogy might be the Naked Gun trilogy haha There's also Blade, but that vibe might feel kinda Matrix-y. Marvel is allegedly shooting a Blade movie rn, with Mahershala Ali as Blade idk if that will count towards making it not a trilogy tho idk idk If you return to the "Very well made but has absolutely soul-crushing themes and vibes" category, there's always Lars Von Trier's Depression trilogy lol Plus if you felt like you didn't have to question the choices of the director in the Vengeance tril enough, you're definitely in luck here hahaha Small consolation is that women have basically the complete opposite amount of agency and character in the Depression tril as they do in the Vengeance tril (so far).

Dave Ruff

(Sorry for the deletions, Patreon really sucks for trying to edit your posts, I had to write this on another editor and paste it in here...) I just listened to this, and my goodness, there's SO much to say... But first of all, I'm loving this series, and your takes vs. the usual, very male, film geek takes on Oldboy, and the rest of the trilogy. Not that there's anything wrong with that latter (I mean, I support a whole bunch of them on SB and Gamefully Un, and elsewhere...), but as a(n older) man myself, it's a great viewpoint hearing the two of you talk about these films. Just for context, I was born in Korea, and got to watch a lot of these movies before they blew up in the States (tho not that much earlier, since I moved to the US damn near 45 years ago, so the "Korean Wave" movies (and K-pop) caught me a bit off guard as well). But I was able to use that as an excuse to hit a bunch of my friends with Oldboy, maybe a year or two after it came out? After it got popular with the film geeks, but not so much with my, very white, friend group, so I was one of those cruel bastards just waiting for my friends' reactions to the revelations (come for the hammer fight, stay for the incest!). Anyway, I really loved your commentary on female portayals in the two movies in the Vengeance trilogy, something that didn't occur to me on my first (or second, or...) viewing, and, oh boy, I'm waiting for your takes on Lady Vengence now! Having said that, there are certainly major issue on how women are portrayed in media in Korea, and really the rest of Asia. And, you know, the rest of the world, but I know my Asian cinema, and it's not great. (Honestly, I could write a whole essay on problems in Korean/Asian culture towards women, LGBTQ, minorities, etc.) Back to the movie though, I thought you'd maybe missed that Dae Su (how to refer to Korean people and their Korean names (and how to spell them) to non-Korean speakers is, maybe another essay I could write) spent 15 freaking years in that room! And only was fed mandu (dumplings, gyoza in Japanese, and another essay on Asian food names referred to by Westerners)! But you do go into that later in your discussions, which I found interesting that you didn't really go too heavily in the manner and amount of torture Dae Su suffers. Speaking of food though, some people do eat live squid and octopus, which as much as I love sashimi (again, a Japanese word, but one that communicates what I mean to Westerners...), I don't like moving food either, plus clean out the guts and stuff first! The maybe heightened realism in Oldboy vs. Sympathy, which is certainly more grounded, was another good talking point. Not just the hypnotism, but the magical sleeping gas (dosage is tricky, there's a reason why anesthesiologists make bank), and just the whole torture/prison hotel where you can pay money to lock up a dude for 15 years, these are all sort of hand-waved away as plot conveniences, and I'm fine with that! Totally valid to be put off though. I was genuinely wondering if you were even going to talk much about the hammer hallway fight, because that is such an iconic scene in the movie, one that draws in a ton of, again, movie nerds. I'm pretty sure that's what sold Oldboy in the US, and maybe rightly so, since, as an action buff, it is incredibly visceral and realistic, and pretty rare and maybe even ground-breaking at the time, especially the cinematography (would love to hear Abe and Adam do a Directorpiece about it). This is getting long, so one final thing, I LOVED that closet. Shower makes no sense, but I want that closet! (Yes, Koreans, esp. new rich, love gauche gadgets, WAY more than Americans or even Japanese. No, that's not a great thing.) Sorry, one more thing: when you're done with this, and want some more Korean misery in your life, may I highly recommend I Saw the Devil, also starting Choi Min Shik, Mr. Oldboy himself? Damn, really last thing, bit of trivial that may impact your next viewing: "Lady Vengeance" is not a wholly accurate translation of the original title. It's called 친절한 금자씨, which is "Friendly Lady Vengeance" ("Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance" was also originally "복수는 나의 것," which is basically Vengeance is Mine). Take of that what you will. :D