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History in the Making... (Patreon)

Published:
2021-03-16 23:22:18
Edited:
2021-03-16 23:28:30
Imported:
2021-03

Content

It is rare that I get  to live through my videos before filming, but I'll take it.

Edit: Sorry to be vague - it's the Hungarian Dragunov being sold by Military Arms Channel.


Files

Comments

Tyler Horne

I feel like I'm out of the loop

Almeida

I spit my Jameson laughing at this

Anonymous

I am also confused

nk

Also lost

Ian Hudson

Are you at liberty to say what the HD-18 is? either way, I look forward to learning more

Anonymous

FEG SVG BunGroker

Anonymous

Hungary + Dragunov maybe? Would made a match I think 💪

Anonymous

I assume this is the FEG HD-18 fiasco currently ravaging MAC.

Will P

A google search shows that there’s a Hungarian company that is attempting to import SVD pattern rifles (and calling them HD-18) I assume that this is about those

Anonymous
>>55740297

Hungarian SVD newly available in the US. Google is your friend.

Anonymous

What a reasonable price

Anonymous

Lmao that's meta. This is about military arms channel controversy.

Anonymous

Is it this? https://coppercustom.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=44799

Will Sanders

I would have thought you watching Karl with the S333 was history enough and now someone else is serving it up too!

Anonymous

It's a mess and I hate it because I really like Tim

Anonymous

Mans gotta eat

Anonymous

Ugh this stings. I had been following the development of this project on the AK Forum thread for at least a year or two just for it to end up like this.

Anonymous

Ian, delete this if I'm wrong and I want to apologize in advance, this is just what people are saying online. I'm an idiot, so read it with discretion https://www.reddit.com/r/Firearms/comments/m5zanl/good_thing_february_mac_warned_me_about_scalpers/gr56spw

Anonymous

Summary: die hard AK fans worked to get Hungarian SVDs imported and created a waiting list for those interested just for only 100 to come in and immediately get swooped up by shady merchants, most notably Tim at copper customs who put them on gun broker at a 5 k starting price. The AK community is furious and made fake gun broker accounts to Jack the price up in protest.

Anonymous

What in the world is going on?

Anonymous

Hehehehehe...

Anonymous
>>55740913

Thank you for the summary. I really had no idea what this was about.

Anonymous
>>55740970

People have been cooped up to long, everybody is angry at everyone else.

Anonymous

LOL, this has turned into an absolute shit storm, Mr. Lahey from Trailer Park Boys has a good quote that could apply to this situation

Anonymous

Ouch. Having no idea what this was about I went to catch myself up.. Yikes.

Anonymous

Guys its my understanding that FEG did not authorize whomever was taking the waiting list and setting prices to do so. They're releasing a statement sometime soon. I'm not sure any of this is Tim's fault IMO.

Anonymous

Just went to MAC, seems like a "well Tom, I'm down here at what appears to a shitstorm in progress in the comment section" kinda situation.

Anonymous

I would tread very carefully and make sure you are absolutely sure of the facts before making any kind of a statement Ian. MAC isn't selling them

Anonymous

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/895193769

Anonymous

Eh, legit SVDs sell for more than 5k used, I’m not worried that they aren’t for sale at Palmetto prices. There’s only 100 imported, sounds like the market wins when there’s enough rich folks to throw cash around. I don’t blame Tim/Copper in the least

Anonymous

Did the people on this list actually put money down? If not then the list is pretty irrelevant.

Anonymous

The return of Ian MemeCollum

Clifton Ballad

I mean, I've had a beer or 2.... But when I looked on the link provided by someone earlier in these comments; it was $9,999,998.00. Am I actually reading this right? I can already see Ian trying so hard to suppress the cringe at explaining how someone butchered a True SVD to try and turn it into an HD-18...

Anonymous
>>55744877

I posted the link according to what I have dug up, and I may be wrong, they are fake bids so that they don't sell. MACs side if the story they got 50 and put 5 on gunbroker to see where the market was at. It was understood that the price would be about a 1000 less than the opening bid on gunbroker. This has seriously PO people who legitimately thought they were on the list to get one.

Anonymous

Meh, not Kovrov.

Trapper Jeff, MD (not an actual doctor)

I'd make a funny comment here at Tim's expense, but then he'd find some way to ban or block me like he's doing to everyone all over social media. ~_^

Anonymous

Epic. I love the internet

Anonymous

I talked to Sean at Trident and he told me if I wanted "one of these 100" that I had to talk to Copper.

Anonymous

Many of us rallied around Karl last fall... I ask that you reserve judgment of Tim until FEG's statement comes out.

Anonymous
>>55750492

I agree. There’s a lot of conjecture and assuming going on that’s leading to an awful lot of vitriol. I hate to think about the future of imports if this is how folks get treated for bringing a rare rifle to the US. Why would anyone bother?

Anonymous
>>55746732

Some new build SVD clones have been imported. There is drama occurring.

Anonymous

Warning: minefield ahead.

Anonymous
>>55744505

Didn’t MAC state that a true Russian SVD would be like $20k and a Chinese NDM-86 was currently on GB for $8-9k? I understand how auctions favor the rich and that can be upsetting to us poors, but starting at $5k for such a rare rifle doesn’t seem “shady” to me. If anything, the thought of some fool paying $10 million for one just tickles my funny bone.

Jack92783
>>55740627

I don't. I'm by no means on a crusade about it, but my first experience with his channel was when I had purchased a Ruger American Pistol, having tried it on the range and liking it a lot, and then gone to see what the talking heads on youtube had to say about it. MAC's video was really the only major discussion of it, and it amounted to him complaining about the design of the slide release. It really felt like he had determined that he disliked the pistol before he ever got the thing in his hands, and designed the video around that conclusion.

Bo Fønss

I am just sitting here grinning all over at this circus of proportions, sipping my single malt and having a good laugh at how the renowned free market suddenly is too free.

Bo Fønss
>>55765022

That said, I do believe in common decency and I am well aware that once money starts talking, decency goes out the window. Decent people can turn into the nastiest creatures once greed kicks in.

Will Sullivan

When in proximity of shitstorm, be careful that you are far enough away to not get any shit on you, but be close enough to still mine precious lols.

Anonymous

So, after spending way too much of my valuable time looking at all the available evidence and comments I'm left to the conclusion that Copper/MAC/Tim should NOT be getting raked over the coals for this and didn't really do anything wrong initially. From that perspective I can understand his angry responses in the video's comment section, although that probably isn't the best way to win people over. Maybe they were also naive in listing the rifle for $7500 on the website and then listing 5 rifles for a $5000 starting price on GB. All that said, it seems like this is pretty nuclear-level drama over nothing. If you were on that "list" for the rifles then you got mislead or duped but I don't think that is the fault of FEG, the importer or Copper. The 2A community is really its own worst enemy. What dealer or importer is going to stick his neck out in the future to bring a cool rifle into the country when they risk having this kind of response?

Anonymous
>>55774084

I came to the same conclusion after looking at it. I think one of the factors is people like me who had no interest in the gun or the the people involved who came to witness the chaos with snacks in hand.

Anonymous

Stick some mlok accessories on the handguard vents

Anonymous

I also don't understand the hate for GunBroker. I've sold off parts of my rifle collection at times, mostly on GunBroker. The starting price was usually a little below my cost to incentivize bids. Most have sold for around what I paid for them or a little above. A few I've lost money on and a few have sold for stupid money. Judging by the numbers I've seen posted, the cost to buy the HD-18s from FEG, transport them into the country and pay all the fees is above $4000. Then the importer needs to make a profit to cover all their other overhead and costs which means Copper probably paid close $4500-5000 for them. So starting the bidding at $5000 seems perfectly reasonable. I can understand why people are upset that they can't afford those prices but I would also like to buy a SMG FG-42 that I can't afford. I'm just trying to understand where all this insane level of vitriol is coming from. Did MAC/Copper do something in the past and this is just the final straw?

Anonymous

Just be careful disassembling the ones that sold for over 9 million on Gunbroker. Wouldn't want to scratch the finish.

Anonymous
>>55782852

There has been a multi year effort to get them imported and them MAC/Copper swooped in at the last moment and bought them, MAC has said he had no knowledge of a list that got the ball rolling and has said the person who started the list was not authorized to, MAC/Copper posted on IG that all 100 would be sold on GB that post is now removed and MAC says that only 5 are being sold on GB and anyone who says otherwise is lying, AND something like a month ago MAC posted a video saying who it is horrible for people to buy guns cheaply and then turn around and sell them on GB after jacking the price up.

Gungnir762

Are you buying it?

Anonymous

Bid was over 9 million this afternoon but now it's down to 10k. Something fishy going on there

Anonymous

Seems like Copper can just block bids by buyers with no positive feedback to keep the auctions from going nuts again. $10,000+ is a bit much for those rifles though.

Anonymous

There's been a ton of misinformation on this. MAC and Copper don't deserve the heat they are getting. Please look a little more at the facts of the situation. The reason for the price is from the manufacturer then the importer then finally the retailer. There are only 50 of the 100 talked about in the US. Most of which have been sold to patreons now, if not all of them. There will be some official statements from the manufacturer that will cover the "list". If everything goes as planned, they are working on getting steady shipments of these and the price should go down some.

Beccaskye

Was the original "signup list" set up by either the importer or Copper Custom?

Anonymous

Starting bid at 5k, went over 9.5 million, back down to 10k and then back up over 800k on the same SN rifle. Absolutely crazy

Anonymous

When you do the review I would suggest only barely touching on any of this drama, your channel has done a remarkable job of staying unblemished

Anonymous
>>55822137

Nevermind, apparently there's a number of people willing to risk their real GB accounts with A+ feedback in the attempt to sabotage the auctions. Crazy

Anonymous
>>55824421

No, from what I understand it was set up by someone linked to FEG (but not authorized by FEG) for the purpose of gauging interest in the U.S. in a Hungarian SVD. They had a number of leftover SVD parts but needed to invest in some new tooling in order to finish the rifles. So the list was just to see if there was enough of a potential market to justify the tooling investment. Apparently though, the people on that list thought they were ensuring themselves first dibs on the rifles even though they had put no money down.

Anonymous

The number of people on akfiles and YouTube who think Copper is actually making a million dollars per SVD auction is truly astounding.

Anonymous

FYI, NeverEnuffAmmo has a pretty level-headed TLDR video today on the whole controversy.

Anonymous

I would not buy anything for GunBroker.com.

Anonymous
>>55872711

Why? I've gotten a lot of good deals there. Also, you're not buying from GB - you're buying from a seller using GB as the intermediary.

Anonymous

Copper Custom posted their version of events on their Facebook page. It's a long read, professionally contrite and possibly untruthful. The comments to that post are numerous, extremely profane and also possibly untruthful.

Anonymous
>>55877861

I'd like to know why people involved with the legwork to get this started are claiming, and whether it's true, that their forum accounts are being banned when they speak out. There's more to this than what we're being told and when the dust settles I really don't think Tim and Copper are going to retain their sterling reps. They've made too many statements and then reversed on them. That's just my read of what's been said. Of course they're going to claim that everything they did was just and ethical, but we really need to hear all sides of the story. I think it's a telling fact that the people who we were promised statements from have yet to comment. Just a POV from a slightly different perspective.

Anonymous
>>55872711

Honestl;y no offense to anyone,especially you but i have had several purchases on Gunbroker with no issue.Now as it has been said your really not dealing with gunbroker directly your dealing with a seller and yes if you get some crackpot it could make or break a deal.also yes some of the ridiculous prices on items can be directly related to buyer frenzy.

Anonymous

The “colonel ‘ has had this coming for a while

Anonymous

I never liked watching Tim on MAC. So what’s all the chat about? I must be out the loop.

Beccaskye

They belong in a museum! 😁