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How Does it Work: Open Bolt vs Closed Bolt Firearms (Patreon)

Published:
2018-12-30 17:49:43
Imported:
2021-03

Content

Scheduled for January 3rd. This is the first of a series I am doing on specific different types of firearm action and operation principles and systems. I want to keep them short and to the point, to create an easily referenced library for folks who don't know what the various terms and mechanical systems are. That's a group less likely to include you folks on Patreon, but I would welcome your feedback on the idea! 

Files

How Does it Work: Open Bolt vs Closed Bolt Firearms

http://www.patreon.com/ForgottenWeapons Cool Forgotten Weapons merch! http://shop.bbtv.com/collections/forgotten-weapons How Does it Work: Open Bolt vs Closed Bolt Firearms Most semiauto firearms fire from a closed bolt and most fully automatic firearms fire from an open bolt, but these are far from strict rules, and many exception exist. Open bolt offers better cooling and prevents any possibility of cookoff, while closed bolt offers better practical accuracy. Contact: Forgotten Weapons PO Box 87647 Tucson, AZ 85754

Comments

Anonymous

That's tonight's viewing sorted!! Hope you had a great Christmas Ian. All the best to you mate. Cheers from Northern Ireland!!

David Heck

Cool idea for a series.

Anonymous

And yep, cracker idea.

Matisse Enzer

Personally I really like the mechanical detail information. For example I'd really like to see details on some different trigger mechanisms which is (in my opinion) a continuously overlooked area of firearm design and yet one that makes a big difference in the shooting experience.

Anonymous

Great idea.

Anonymous

Great idea.

Anonymous

Great idea, you should cover advanced primer ignition as it’s often misunderstood

Anonymous

I agree that it's a great idea! And don't be too afraid to be very basic, I recently had to explain to a man and his son what a "stripper clip" was and how they operate. Difficult to do drawing pictures in the air, would have liked to know a ready reference, and you certainly qualify.

Anonymous

I don’t think there’s such a thing as too much comprehensive firearms education and knowledge sharing, so a series like this can only be a good thing.

John Dallman

A good start to the series. Might be worth adding sub-titles for the names of the example guns that are shown, since the video skips between them fairly quickly.

Anonymous

I enjoyed the video, and very informative

Anonymous

Agreed. This is a good idea - many civilian shooters that aren’t familiar with military weaponry don’t know open bolt systems exist. Since the laws in the US all but prohibit semi-auto open bolt Title I firearms this is much needed primer for many.

Lurker45

I like this idea. I don't have much of a history with firearms that I imagine many patrons here do and I've learned a lot of basic stuff from watching the videos anyway. I think having a set of short videos on fundamental concepts will really help other mostly gun-ignorant people get into the channel.

Anonymous

This is a fantastic idea. I'm looking forward to more in this series.

Almeida

Love it. Possible idea: machined vs stamped parts firearms. As a machinist who uses ww2 era machines and modern cnc, my favorite part about firearms is the manufacturing techniques

Anonymous

Do the HK quad pack vp70z, p7, p9s, and any of the normal short recoil locked action guns like the USP or the VP9

Anonymous

Great idea Ian!! In a prelude to this particular video, you might want to go over some terminology. What is a bolt? How is that different than a bolt carrier? Explaining this stuff to my family, I've found you really have to start at the basic nuts and bolts (pun intended)

Anonymous

Fantastic idea for a series, some of the delayed systems are misunderstood. Lever delayed Famas roller delayed G3

Anonymous

Very thorough. Anyone that didn't have a basic grasp of the concept, including correct terminology is definitely going to benefit from a video like this. Spot on.

Anonymous

Great idea. I do think a breif video of some parts and terminology would be good for laypeople who don't understand things like bolts.

Anonymous

I remember when I really liked guns, but knew very little about them. Back then, my only real sources of knowledge were the guy at the gun counter (we all know how reliable he can be...) and trial and error. YouTube University has advanced my knowledge so much further than I thought it could go. I love the idea of you, the professor for the phd capstone class, making videos for those who need the basic principles.

Anonymous

Great Idea, I had recommended your "how to clear and safe a weapon" to friend going on mission trips, "just in case". That said. maybe a basic, parts of a gun might be helpful. beyond trigger, barrel, bullets.

Anonymous

Looks great! I wish I had this when I saw the interview to Ken Hackathorn and he answered the question "What is it that makes [the MP5] the best submachine gun ever?" <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlM-ajb8G7o&amp;feature=youtu.be&amp;t=894" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlM-ajb8G7o&amp;feature=youtu.be&amp;t=894</a>

Lurker45
>>18449892

confusion between bullet and cartridge or "ammo" is common among people very ignorant on the subject so a video like that might be illuminating.

Anonymous

Cool Idea, I know C&amp;Rsenal did something similar. I didn't think I'd be interested in it since it wasn't anything new for me, but it was entertaining to watch all the same!

Matisse Enzer
>>18449739

A really great video on this stuff was made in 1945 and is still very good: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeF3_JHTJBI" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeF3_JHTJBI</a>"Fundamentals of Small Arms Weapons II Types 1945 US Army TF9-1449; How Guns &amp; Rifles Function" (This video is just part 2 of the full thing: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJzXG7MYX1c" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJzXG7MYX1c</a> )

Mark Becht

Absolutely. Keep them short and concise (which is the opposite of what I would want personally) They would be really useful for anyone not familiar with the terms and concepts.

Matisse Enzer
>>18449879

Watch this video: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJzXG7MYX1c" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJzXG7MYX1c</a> and share it with people who need some education :-)

Anonymous

Great idea - fundamentals are important

Anonymous

I like it. The what and the why. I'm assuming you'll also do different types of gas piston (short vs. long stroke) action along with the blowback and locked breech? Perhaps a video on magazines vs. clips and also something explaining full semi-automatic for us n00bs!

Anonymous

Yes, very good information to put in the library!

Anonymous

I definitely like when you cover the basics, I often find myself with a vastly better understanding of how incredibly esoteric guns work than perfectly ubiquitous ones simply because you haven’t done a video on them and nobody else on youtube does as good a job of explaining how guns actually work

Gavin Rea-Davies

Unless I've overlooked it, might I suggest putting some links to earlier example videos in the description, one for each permutation discussed? Maybe 1) Open bolt, fixed pin, 2) open bolt, hammer fired, 3) open/closed bolt (FG42?), 4) closed bolt etc.

Ferrous

Solid Idea. Spreading knowledge is never a bad idea

Anonymous

Very good. Detailed enough you come away understanding the topic and brief enough that it isn't inconvienent to watch or show someone.

alphawhiskey

I like the video but I think that starting with closed bolt information and then transitioning to open bolt information might be a bit easier since the average person is more likely to have seen or dealt with a closed bolt system. Cutting back and forth was a bit distracting, especially since if this is for a lay audience, there’s just barely enough time to follow what you are talking about on one subject before you change topics.

Andy Maidment

For true neophytes you'll have to have a video to explain what a bolt is.

Anonymous

You might want to cover the correct manual of arms for various operating mechanisms. Almost every video on youtube with open bolt machine guns the operator in the video does many dangerous actions. Its hard to fault them since there are very few sources for proper operation of open bolt guns. The biggest mistake I keep seeing is popping the top cover or pulling out the magazine before getting the bolt group under control by getting it on the sear. The number of ND I have seen due to a missfeed that was released when pulling mags or opening top covers boggles my mind. Also there have been a few people who have been shot with older type of MGs that have to be cocked twice to clear the gun (ex 1919A4). I think addressing these issues will help owners that right now do not even know better (aka most owners).

Anonymous

Great idea!👍

Anonymous

Very good idea

Anonymous

I like it. Another cool video would be 2 round burst, and 3 round burst, and the different designs. As far as firearm designs go, I just find it a very interesting challenge, and its interesting to see the different ways this has been solved.

Anonymous

I like it. I happen to have 4 open bolt firearms and am surprised when at the range even most seasoned shooters are unaware of the type and mechanics of the elegantly crude open bolt. The response I receive is often they are so simple why aren't they making them anymore. Also in my experience especially in the .22 versions accuracy is no less than with any other semi. In fact maybe better since the round is set off on two sides of the rim. And really rapid fire group of a .45 OB is not to much different than a typical rapid fire AR. The Gevarm caught my eye, loved it.

Anonymous

Great idea and video. I've often thought how cool/informative/useful it would be to give common firearms and/or operating systems the "Forgotten Weapons" treatment. These short form videos will be a great sidebar for your regular fare. Some suggestions for future videos would be: Browning's tilting link design, striker fired vs. hammer fired, the ARs pseudo-direct impingement vs. piston, short stroke piston vs. long stroke. There are many potential topics here.

Anonymous

For VHP's purposes ('generally') this is not terribly important (the sort that would be able to use this information are usually more knowledgeable than all three of us combined), but we very much know of another organization that would be greatly benefited by these types of videos.

Anonymous

Excellent idea.

Anonymous

I actually had no clue what the difference was, so I'm glad I finally know.

Anonymous

A very useful reference for when I'm talking to my not quite so firearms nerdy friends, some of whom are kind f interested in firearms (from the UK, so not as much general interest in firearms culturally).

Anonymous

👍. Looks great!

Anonymous

I would add in the sequence of the sear trip to elevate it to intermediate

Anonymous

Awesome idea for content! The only thing I would add would be some sort of intro that simply states what your going to be talking about. Also as some people have suggested perhaps some basic terminology either in the beginning or in a separate video. Great work!

Anonymous

I agree with the other positive comments. While many of us own a variety of firearms and references a video like this one gives clear explanation of concepts with visual input. These will be very useful to give to new shooters or those interested in firearms!

Anonymous

Excellent tutorial Ian! This type of material helps demystify “scary guns” and could actually be a positive force in quelling the anti-gun rhetoric. I’d have to give it a 5 star rating 👍

Anonymous

More(accurate) information is never a bad thing. Thank you for your work and dedication to entertaining &amp; informing the masses.

Anonymous

I think that for the goal of an information archive, this series-to-be is a very good idea.

Anonymous

I think that this is clear and well presented, but it seemed a bit flat. Thinking about it, I believe that it could benefit from a bit more color--perhaps some more history on the use of open and close bolt elements in gun designs and how they came to be used in different applications. Even identifying the weapons used for the demonstrations would provide more context. While the added context would make the video longer, a 10 minute video is very watchable and more color would blend the video more into the general approach that the channel takes to firearms.

Anonymous

Excellent idea Ian. You have a great way of explaining things and this is great reference material.

Anonymous

It is nice. The guns showed are cool and that makes my english better! Keep it short like this, I'm maybe not the only one here to not have the time to watch a video of 30min every day...

Dana Arbeit

Good idea and a nice first episode. Your work demonstrates a high level of skill in communication. Keep up the excellent work.

Anonymous

It's a wonderful idea. I am finding it hard to find a single source of documentation on the more general firearm principles (I read Findlay's book as suggested by you, and it left me longing for more!). The video presented just the right amount of knowledge in a simple and effective way. A small suggestion: it would be nice to have a video (or more) on the general anatomy of a firearm, the purpose of each component and how it fulfils that purpose. I feel that this kind of knowledge comes mostly with owning a firearm, and unfortunately some of us live in places where that's not easy/possible. I am yet to find a single coherent source on the subject that also has the same quality as your content!

Anonymous

I think it's an excellent idea. I would start with the basics for new shooters and working to the more complex and odd. You might throw in some Gunsmithing terms I'm sure there's lots of us that are Shooters and do minor repairs but we're by no means gunsmiths.

Anonymous

It's a great idea but I think you should start simpler. This clip already gets into a bit more detail than a neophyte would understand. What I would suggest is an initial video of basic vocabulary--single shot, bolt action, lever action, slide action, semi-auto, auto, open bolt, closed bolt, parts of a gun (receiver, barrel, trigger, hammer, striker, sear, magazine, clip, etc.) Then later do a deep dive on specific topics.

Anonymous

I like the idea - short and to the point but detailed on a very specific principle for future reference.

Brian Reddeman

Make for a great play list and when complete a neat idea for a fire arms primer video on Amazon Prime.

Anonymous

This video relies on knowing some simple terminology (e.g. bolt, hammer, striker, chamber) that someone new to firearms may not be familiar with. I think the series should start with an explanation of these terms with others that will be needed to understand what you are referring to in the rest of the series.

Anonymous

My opinion on this is 1) It's a great topic to address, as well as the other basic terms or categories 2) A short introduction of the question could make it a bit more approachable 3) With this topic specifically, I would limit the bolt manipulation that isn't the shooting sequence as much as possible. All that cocking of the bolt etc. makes it harder to understand which parts of the movement happen when the trigger is pulled, and which are just you manipulating the bolt. 4) The departure into the technicalities of US firearms law is probably superfluous

MattC10/63

I wish there was a way to test if open bolt guns are less accurate then closed. Like testing the same firearm one open and one closed and test single shot groups and also burst and mag dumps.

Anonymous

MattC10/63 - I've played a wee bit with a Gevarm made semi auto .22 rimfire and it was absolutely one of the least accurate semi - auto .22 rifles I've personally used. It stands out as such after a lifetime of fooling with different ones. As well, I recall examining a Sten and was surprised how much the muzzle dropped down when the bolt slammed forward. I will say it felt like the bolt on it weighed close to a pound, so that wasn't surprising really. Anyway small samples I realize, but I'd guess most open bolts would suffer from that at least to some extent.

Wilhelm Screamer

I really feel like this video would have benefited from the typical Forgotten weapons style of opening

Anonymous

Oh, but that group does include me. Very helpful. Thanks.

Anonymous

One other thought--if the intention is to attract people who might not otherwise discover the channel, another way the attract those folks would be to do a series on collecting firearms--picking an area of interest, doing research, where to buy, how to buy, pricing, etc. You've touched on a lot of this in the various Q&amp;As, but the topics could easily support stand-alone videos.

Anonymous

Although I know a lot of the theory, having no access to firearms now, I don't pick up a lot of the detail or practicality unless someone spells it out for me. It wasn't until Hickock45 pointed it out that I realised that inserting a new magazine into an open bolt submachine with an automatic bolt hold open and a fixed firing pin could lead to unexpected consequences. Ridiculously basic but it just never occurred to me. I usually learn something from the basic stuff.

Anonymous

Don’t go and think that this isn’t good for us as well. There’s a lot of things regarding firearms where I know there’s a difference between some things, but really don’t understand the details regarding those differences. Also, sometimes I need several people to tell me something before it ever sticks, so this is great for me.

Anonymous

More of this! I'd love an episode on basic machinery, with firearms as examples. "You say Cam a lot, but I'm just not seeing the Panthers QB nor the voice actor in your videos at ALL. And who's this lug you keep talking about? Is that what you call Karl??" ;)

Anonymous

Super video - more of these!